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Lawn and Sod

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Berkeley Parents Network > Reviews > House & Garden > Lawn and Sod


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Recommendations for lawn install

Feb 2012

Hi -- I'm looking for recommendations for someone to put in a lawn in our very small Albany backyard. We don't want a full landscape design or a big garden installation. I've looked at the archives, but there aren't really any recent recommendations for someone to do a small lawn project like this. We're looking for someone reliable and easy to work with who can give us a good estimate and stick to it. If you've done a project like this and have a recommendation, please pass it on. We may also install drip irrigation in some areas in the yard, so if the person helped you with irrigation, that would be great to know. Thanks! Want a patch of grass


I use 3 tiers of gardeners for my large property, and my mid-tier guy is your man. Call Santiago Samayoa at (510) 860-9251. He has done a lot of work for me, clearing, maintenance, weeding, pruning and has installed and repaired my irrigation on my large 1/2 acre property and installed small patches of sod (lawn) in areas of repair. He is super reasonably priced, comes when he says, does what he says, and wants to please very much so if anything isn't right he will fix it. He can easily install a lawn for you, and I highly recommend you have him put in irrigation at the same time. it is much more disruptive and troublesome and also more expensive to retrofit it. Lawns are sensitive and need regular watering and in the future if you go away you will be so happy you have the irrigation. Santiago also does regular maintenance if you want regular mowing. I also use another regular mower who has been with me for years and is reliable and reasonable in price: Enrique Sanchez (510) 812-4353. Kay
I used Pat Hannan of YourGreenSpaces.com and found him and his team to be very competent and substantially less expensive than the others who bid on this job. It was a small lawn, like yours, and he was knowledgeable about grass types, irrigation, he put in sprinklers and a drain, and despite my laziness, it's looking great. He has also put in lawns for schools and offices that are VAST. He is extremely responsive and a very nice guy, easy to work with. His other specialty is hardscapes and building fences/decks - you can see samples on his website. Pat has become my go-to guy for everything related to the garden and I have recommended him to many people! His cell: 925-435-2801. Sarah

Sheet mulching our front yard

Sept 2011

We are looking for someone who will sheet mulch our front yard which is currently mostly lawn (much neglected). Does anyone have recommendation for a gardener who would do such work? We are located in Lamorinda area. Thank you! Desparately seeking sheet mulching person


Hi, I sheet-mulched my yards two years ago and am 100% thrilled that I did. It has saved so much water and time and the look is so much nicer. I worked with a Claudia Vieira, a garden coach, who helped me through the process and who brought in the teen labor to do the hands-on work. She can be reached at: (510) 653-6535 or CVGardenDesign@gmail.com Pat

How do I get rid of my lawn?

Nov 2010

How do I get rid of my lawn that is mostly weeds in a nontoxic way?I'm in a rental, so I'd like it make this as economical as possible - but I really want to enoy my backyard and just can't! It's all foxtails and brown weeds for most of the year. Kelly


Six years ago I rented a rototiller from Hertz in Berkeley and spent a very long, tiring day going back and forth across my lawn to dig it up. My neighbors all thought I was nuts, but it worked! I planted natives and neither the lawn nor the weeds (mostly!) has returned. BTW I'm an average sized, but incredibly stubborn, woman! Good luck.
There are several methods for dealing with that 'lawn' or weedy meadow, however you want to look at it. One method is to give it some summer water and cut it as if it were a lawn - weeds need far less water than turf, but when mowed can look pretty nice. A second option is to dig it out - cheap, but takes a lot of stamina and muscle. A third option is to tarp it until it dies (3-6 months). A fourth option that has become quite popular is to sheet mulch, which means covering the lawn with cardboard or newspaper and placing mulch on top. The lawn dies for lack of sun and air, and in time you have great soil to plant in. Heidi

Lawn alternative to traditional grass?

Feb 2010

We are very interested in possibly replacing our lawn with drought-resistant native plants-- preferably native grasses so that it can still be used as a ''lawn'' and not just be ornamental. We have started asking around and are finding that it is hard to find someone who can help. A workshop we attended focused on the type of landscaping that is purely ornamental-- attractive but not very kid- friendly for playing. Anyone do this successfully? Have an East Bay nursery or landscaper you would recommend? The grass is Always Greener


We used artificial lawn in our backyard to cover a large concrete spot and we never ever regretted it. It looks real, it is comfortable to sit and lay and play on. It can get pretty hot in the summer, though. The company we used is called synlawn (www.synlawn.com). Jules
California native grasses are naturally clumping. They are sometimes referred to as bunch grasses. They do not make a turf like our typical lawn grasses. You may want to consider something that isn't grass like thyme or clover. If you go to one of our great local nurseries, or the botanical garden at Tilden or at UC Berkeley, you could get some ideas of low-growing plants that aren't turf, but may still meet your needs. Alternatively, you can drastically reduce the size of your turf and plant the rest in perennials and vegetables and fruit trees, or you can go to water permiable pavers. anon.
Hi- I'm a garden designer, horticulturist, and landscape contractor with 30 years experience, and the truth is that there aren't any CA native grasses that can function as a fully usable lawn. Most are clumping grasses that are very lumpy and don't take well to mowing. The one exception to that is creeping red fescue which is fine textured, will thinly fill in, and can be mowed (or left unmowed), but it's not tough enough for heavy use. It does best in light shade with regular water (it will survive drought but will not be at its best) and can look quite nice when it's healthy.
You might want to check out Lara, who owns Bountiful Botanicals in Oakland. http://www.bountifulbotanicals.com/ We've hired her firm to do basic irrigation repair at our house, but I think they are mainly known for their design services. She installed a lawn at one of my neighbor's homes, that is drought-friendly and native. It definitely looks like the type of lawn that you could still play on...the only difference I see between it and a traditional lawn is that the grass is slightly clumpier...but it looks great. Amy

Where can I buy turf for my back yard?

Nov 2008

Can anyone suggest a good place to buy turf for my back yard, its about 1,000SF. mathew


Many years ago, I got dwarf fescue seed from Flowerland Nursery for my front lawn in Albany. Then, several years ago, I got sod from them (same grass as the seed I think) for a lawn in Berkeley. The dwarf fescue grows slowly, so doing it from seed takes patience. One of the advantages of dwarf fescue is that, once established, one doesn't have to mow as often! I have been very happy with their assistance and products. Flowerland Nursery at 1330 Solano Av in Albany (510-526-3550). Brenda

Have you used Eco Lawn?

Aug 2008

Hi, Has anyone tried a product called Eco Lawn. With the drought conditions we're in, I thought it would be a good alternative to what I currently have. Thanks! dead grass


Hi, Here's an interesting blog commenting on Eco Lawn: http://www.gardenrant.com/my_weblog/2007/09/eco-lawn---the-.html. I haven't used it before so I can't say one way or the other, but I thought you should know that Pacific Sod also carries a ''no mow'' lawn that looks similar and would not require the many hours of weeding a seeded lawn. Not sure how the water requirements compare. Also, even if it takes less water than a conventional lawn, you will still probably want an irrigation system. I recommend you talk to The Urban Farmer Store in Richmond (near Costco) about in-line emitter tubing placed under the lawn for very water efficient irrigation. Good luck! Claudia
I thought you should know that Pacific Sod also carries a ''no mow'' lawn that looks similar and would not require the many hours of weeding a seeded lawn. Not sure how the water requirements compare. Also, even if it takes less water than a conventional lawn, you will still probably want an irrigation system. I recommend you talk to The Urban Farmer Store in Richmond (near Costco) about in-line emitter tubing placed under the lawn for very water efficient irrigation.

I must disagree. ''No Mow'' is a sod blend of hard, creeping red and fine fescues. It's very shade tolerant (for turfgrass). It's also supposed to be fairly low water use/drought tolerant (again, this is lawn...it does need quite a bit more water than coyote brush, for example).

No mow is a misnomer. You will have to mow it, but probably less often than ''regular'' turf. You will get weeds....yes, we are in the west, the weed seedbanks are everywhere!! You will want an irrigation system. The underground emitter turf irrigation systems pretty much require you to remove your soil and replace it with 6-10 inches of sand. This is not a trivial exercise. If you have clay soil, such a system will not work without replacing the soil.

No Mow looks a heck of a lot better than plastic grass though. Ray


Artificial Lawns?

June 2008

We are thinking about putting in an artificial lawn in our 560 sq. ft. backyard to save water and to minimize maintenance. We've read that the new materials they use now are very life- like, good for kids to play on and pets to do their business around, and basically maintenance-free after installation. Does anyone have any experience with choosing, ordering, installing and (hopefully) enjoying their artificial lawn? Pros and Cons? Recommended companies? Does the product actually live up to the promises?
Looking for Lawn in All the Wrong Places


Park Day School in Oakland has a playground with artificial turf and would be a good example for you to see. I think it's been there over 5 years and still looks great. I'm a landscape designer and as a naturalist I never thought I'd like this stuff, but it does look and feel amazingly real and fits some real challenges. I recommend the brand called 'SynLawn' (http://www.synlawn.com) because it does not have the little rubber balls that eventually wash away like the other brands. I prefer their 'SynBlue' as it looks the most natural. Artificial turf has been great for wear and tear of kids and dogs (it does not burn skin or yellow from dog pee) and areas where grass is tough to grow under shade or areas that you just don't want to water but you want visual satisfaction. You can install it yourself or I'd be happy to recommend a contractor who could. That said, the down side is disposal and environmental impact. It's plastic. And though it saves water for the environment, the planet has already taken its toll from petrol-chemicals. Leigh
Hi, We had a big patch of concrete that we covered with artificial lawn and we are very happy with it- it is soft and has different hues of green. It looks like real grass. We bought it from synlawn.com and it was well worth its price. JZ

Anyone used Heavenly Greens (artificial lawns)?

May 2007

Just saw this company advertised in a local mailing, they are called Heavenly Greens and install an artificial turf/lawn called ''FieldTurf''. Can anyone offer any positive or negative comments about the company or product? It is appealing to us to have a spot of grass for the kids that requires no watering or mowing! Does it look like astroturf?! Thanks anon


I do not own a synthetic lawn, but I've done some research for a school project. FieldTurf, the artificial turf that Heavenly Greens sells, has some good points; primarily that it uses zero water and does not require pesticides or fertilizers. And of course, you don't have to mow it, which means no noxious emissions from a lawn mower. However, it heats up way more than natural grass or even concrete--not the safest play surface in the summertime. Also, although the company emphasizes that FieldTurf's cushioning uses recycled Nike sneaker soles, most of the crumb rubber is from recycled tires, which contain lead, arsenic, cadmium, copper, oil, carbon, and benzene. The tiny pellets tend to work their way to the surface of the grass, so you probably wouldn't want FieldTurf for a yard if you've got small kids or babies, who may eat it. (The pellets also get tracked indoors.) You should also ask the company how it suggests keeping the FieldTurf clean. They may suggest regular disinfectant applications, which you may not be wild about. Good luck on your decision. --Oakland mom

Seed or Sod?

April 2007

We are trying to decide whether to seed our 600 sq ft back yard or use sod. It gets a fair amount of direct sunlight over the course of the day. We would optimally like something that doesnmt consume too much water and can handle the impact of kids playing. Any recommendations? Thanks!


I'd go with a sod for a more instant effect. Typically, fine leaf fescues (Festuca rubra, Festuca longifolia, or Festuca commutata) are your best bet in the Berkeley/Oakland area. Tall fescue (Festuca arundinacea) is a coarser leaved, but tougher turf grass that can take more abuse. ray
Would you consider something like a red fescue or a California fescue for a ''meadow'' like appearance? It grows tall but only needs mowing about 4x a year and consumes far less water and can take foot traffic (am not sure how much).

Importantly, Calif. or red fescue, are one of many California Native plants you can choose from, which means they help protect and feed and attract hummmingbirds, butterflies, and other beneficial critters. Do a google for lawn alternatives. See the California Native Plant Society website. I am doing a lawn conversion and replacing with Callifornia natives. Signed, No mo' mowing anymo'


Use sod, not seed! It's the soil preparation that is key to a lawn's success- same amount of work and materials there. Sod does cost more than seed, but it will help to smother out some weed seeds- when you encourage new grass seeds to grow and prosper, you are also encouraging every weed seed in the neighborhood to grow and prosper! If you take proper care of it with regular mowing (at the right height) and fertilizing and a realistic amount of water, sod will make a stronger and healthier lawn in the long run. No lawn is truly ''drought resistant'', but if you get it established so that it develops deep roots, the fescue hybrids need the least amount of water. if you have existing perennial weeds, like either bulbous or creeping oxalis, blackberries, and/or Bermuda grass (the WORST!) I strongly suggest that you use Round-up on them as many times as it takes to deplete the root and seed supply. Sod cannot smother out perennial weeds, and you will regret it if you don't take care of them beforehand- it's worth waiting to have a lawn rather than investing time and money in something that becomes a weed patch. Round-up does not stay active as a toxin in the soil, and it will not inhibit the growth of the new lawn or present a danger to people and animals. Also, don't use the lawn for at least 4 weeks after laying the sod- again, it's worth waiting. If you allow it enough time to really develop a good root system it will hold up much better to heavy use. Finally- DO NOT skimp on soil preparation- the more thoroughly you do it, the more successful the lawn will be. Cecelia
Last spring we seeded the ''lawn'' area (approx 20'x15') of our yard with Festuca rubra (red fescue). It's a native grass that can take foot traffic and doesn't get that tall. Mowing & watering is optional, and just depend on your tolerance for a ''messy'' lawn. We watered occassionally last summer, mostly because I wanted to be sure the grass really ''took''. We've never mowed the lawn - the areas that get more traffic are a little shorter and the other areas got to be about 4''-6'' tall. This spring the seed stalks have came up - they're about a foot tall. My 2-year old daughter and her friends love running through them & playing with the stalks.

We got our seeds from Larner Seeds in Bolinas (www.Larnerseeds.com) - it cost about $15 bucks to cover our patch of lawn. It took a few weeks for the grass to come in - at this time of year you'll probably have to be good about watering the lawn for a while. We didn't use a pre-emergent to reduce weeds, but did spend many afternoons last summer with the kids weeding out the grasses that we didn't want. The folks at Larner are really knowledgeable & can help you with all those details. - love my lumpy lawn


Waterless Grass

March 2007

I'm working on redoing my backyard and I like the idea of installing Waterless Grass (http://www.waterlessgrass.com/index.cfm). You don't have to mow, you don't have to water, it never dies and always looks great. My husband thinks it's a terrible idea, that it will lower the resale value of our home because nobody wants to have a yard with ''lame fake grass.'' What do all of you think? Jill


I'm sorry to tell you that your husband is pretty much right. My cousin had it installed in her yard. The stuff does look great - from a few feet away you can't tell the difference. If you get upclose you can see that its synthetic but thats not a huge deal. The problem is the wear. A neighbor's dog peed on the ''lawn'' and the whole thing smelled NASTY. And on a hot day, forget it. You wouldnt even want to have the window open. Don't believe the whole thing about urine running through it like rainwater. Not true.
I would have to agree with your husband.

Although there is more at stake than just your property value. Astro Turf was bad eonough, but realistic looking synthetic grass???? I checked out the ''Waterless Grass'' website. Some of their selling points are: ''No wasting water. No more polluting lawn mowers. No chemical fertilizers or pesticides.''

My response to those selling points are: There are many other ways to beautify your back yard and not have to use a ton of water, it's called ''drought tolerant'' plants. The amount of pollution and waste that goes into making synthetic grass must be enormous! And it's plastic! Plastics come from petroleum! It's all chemicals. Plastics can off-gas, meaning it gives off gas and fumes. What happens when it sits in the hot hot sun? What kind of chemicals are you breathing? There is a 5 year warranty on this ''Waterless Grass'' as long as you do the yearly application of UV protection. Sounds like more chemicals to me.

Here is a commentary from a blogger who just happens to have a neighboor who installed ''Waterless Grass''. It doesn't sound like a good idea:

http://blogging.la/archives/2005/09/the_stepford_la.phtml

If we all want to combat pollution and greenhouse gases that cause global warming, than we need to be ''greening'' the planet, not stripping away the greenery and replacing it with petrolium products. Real trees and plants help to absorb carbon dioxide. They make our planet beautiful. They are healthy for the environment, people and animals.

Research: drought tolerant gardening; California native plants; low maintenance easy care plants; alternative ground covers instead of traditional lawns.

That's what I think. Laurey


Instead of grass or fake grass, how about putting in a low maintenance ground cover that requires little to no water and no mowing? Maria

Mud clumps all over lawn

Oct 2006

Last winter, I noticed a lot of pieces of mud all over my lawn. Now that the weather is getting cool again its happening again. It looks like the earthworms are excavating and pushing dirt to the surface. I know earthworms are good, but I also like to have a lawn I can walk on without shoes. Am I over watering? Has anyone else had this problem? muddy lawn


The piles of mud you are seeing sound like molehills. Unfortunaley, there isn't much you can do EGW
Could be racoons! They just hit our back yard (last year it was our front yard). They dig for grubs under your sod. They take up little bits of your grass and expose the mud underneath. Sometimes they will take up whole sections of grass sod. If you think it's the worms lower your watering, but it could be those cute furry creatures. Anon

Where to buy sod

June 2005

Can anyone recommend a place to buy sod for DIY installation? I'm specifically interested in shade-tolerant sods (any thoughts or recommendations there?) like maybe a fescue/bluegrass mix (based on what I've read, but I'm open to other suggestions). Thanks in advance for your help! JP


To answer my own posting in case anyone else has the same question: I went ahead and ordered sod from The Sod Shop in Martinez (www.thesodshop.com) - they were very helpful, fast and well-priced. They recommended Mello Jade for shady yard. We installed it ourselves in an afternoon, no problems. It's been 2 weeks and the lawn looks great! JP

Remediating Soil & Lawn sprayed with weed killer

May 2005

Hi - we just moved into a new house in East Oakland and inherited a perfect lawn and a big plot of dirt out in back, not to mention two large containers of weed killer. We have a dog and an 8 month old and I am concerned that we are all being exposed to the weed killer that was undoubtedly put on the lawn and the backyard to keep the weeds away. Does anyone know how to deal with soil that has chemicals in it? And how does one safely clean up a lawn? Is it possible? Is there anyway to test for the toxicity in the soil? Also does anyone know a child friendly alternative to a lawn. I've heard of chamomile and clover, but do they create a cushion like a lawn would? thanks so much... Catherine


Depending upon when you moved into the house and when the previous owners last squirted/applied the weed and feed I would not worry. Most of it ends up in the soil(under the grass) or as run off after a few rains. We've had a really wet winter. The grass, after a few cuttings, will be perfectly safe for your dog and child. I would use the extra soil you have (in the plot) as a place to plant flowers. Dirt is expensive to haul off b/c of it's weight. So relax, enjoy the grass and carfully (and legally) dispose of the chemicals. We had the same situation when we moved into our home, and our previous home's owners had way more stuff than just weed and feed. enjoy the grass!
If the name of the chemical is on the containers, you can find out what its 'persistence' in the soil is. Some chemicals don't stick around in their original form for very long, others do. If the information on the label is not clear, you have several ways to get the info: Inquire at a nursery that sells chemicals (like East Bay in Berkeley). Or go online and google it. Or contact the company that manufactured the product and ask for the data on its toxicity and persistence.

The best way to hurry any toxicity out of soil is to leach it through with water. Water your lawn more frequently (and deeply!) than you normally would, but not so much that it is soggy all the time (bad for the lawn).

There is no lawn replacement that is cushiony like a lawn, and nothing that will hold up to frequent use! Take my word for it- I'm a landscaper and have dealt with this question for 25 years. There are groundcovers, like chamomile, that can take "light traffic", but this means only occasional very light use, like between stepping stones. Otherwise, it will not stay healthy, not look nice or feel nice.

Clover is tough, but not cushiony, and it attracts bees- good for your garden plants, but not so good for bare feet. Cecelia


Need a cheap lawn!

August 2003

We've lived in a rental for over 5 years and plan to be here for longer until that mysterios time when we can finally buy a house (probably not anytime soon). When we moved in, we put all sorts of plants and flowering bushes in the dirt-filled backyard after hours of hard labor to clear it out. Now we have a toddler and we just want a lawn back there so he can play in a fenced-in area.

Our landlady probably won't pay for it - so we have to come up with the money ourselves which is going to be really,really tough. But, it's has to happen - we just hired someone to dig out most of the old stuff and it's all dirt (sigh, again) back there.

Does anyone have any suggestions about how to install a lawn? I'm thinking roll-out sod/turf that will quickly root. But we have lots of weeds that grow back there, and as I said, very little money. I'm afraid if we just spread grass seed, we'll get an uneven, weed filled mess and I really am dreaming of a place that's fun to hang out with the kid.

Thanks for your advice and suggestions. If you know someone we could go to for this, that would be great too. jenny


Rolling out sod may seem like the better solution, but it really isn't. You have to weed, rototill and level the area in any case. Then, if you put in sod, you only have one kind of grass. Some areas of your lawn get more water, some get more traffic, some get more sun. The lawn will die in certain areas. You will forever be fighting to keep a perfect green carpt. A better and cheaper alternative is to seed it. Put in several different kinds of grass and dichondra. Then, when you find spots that aren't doing well, put in chamomile, lawn daisies, plaintain, and dandylions. This will create a beautiful butterfly meadow that is easy to maintain. a gardener

How to plant sod

March 2003

We recently moved to home with a backyard (our first ever). A significant portion of the yard was covered in Algerian ivy which I've spend the last month removing. We'd like to put in sod (where the ivy was) -- but we can't afford any of the estimates we've gotten so our only option is to do it ourselves. How do I know whether I need to amend our soil? Is the job as simple as rototilling, raking, grading and then laying the sod? Is there anywhere i can go for specific instructions? Thanks very much. Annette


We did our own backyard and nothing could be easier than laying your own sod. Having someone else do it is nothing but robbery! We were quoted $1200 to sod our lawn and we did it ourselves for $350 (the cost of the sod). The only tricky part is having a large enough vehicle to transport it (if you go pick it up yourself). Yes, you should ammend your soil. Ask at your local nursery for ammendment suggestions, pile it on and rototill it in. Or you can just throw regular fertilizer on it if your soil isn't too bad (ours was pure clay so we had to do a lot).

The just go ahead and unroll the sod, give it a good soaking with water (get it nice and soggy and keep it that way for the next 12 hours or so). You might want to get one of those little sod cutters if you have to work around any trees or other obstacles in your lawn. Also, sod is heavy so if you have a dolly or a wheelbarrow to move it from the truck to the yard that will save your back. email me if you have any questions and good luck! cameron


Doing a lawn right is labor intensive, but shortcuts will reduce its health and longevity. Soil preparation is key. Work the soil when moist but not gooey.

Our clay soils are compacted, & rototilling does not open them deeply (affects drainage & root growth). Break up with shovel & pick to about 12''.

All soils here need organic amendment- for a lawn, at least 1 part to 2 parts soil- turn in well to 12''. Then, rototil to blend the top layer finely.

Grade, & then water for a week or 2 to settle. Next do a finish grade with a grading rake, roll with a roller 2/3 full of water, grade again, roll again, etc. until the grade is just right (it will be a bit mounded until it finishes settling).

Spread starter lawn fertilizer, lay the sod, roll with the roller 1/3 full of water.

Saturate the sod, keep it very wet for the first week, then wet for 2 weeks, then moist for another 1-2 weeks. Don't use it for 4 weeks.

Consider putting in an irrigation system- you & your lawn will be grateful! Cecelia


Hi Annette, My husband & I have installed sod at 2 different houses relying solely on advice & supplies from Sloat Garden Center (SF and Marin); they are very willing to answer questions in detail over the phone. The hardest part is clearing out the weeds, so you're more than halfway! Get yourself a soil test kit and then augment according to those results. Grass likes nitrogen so we had to augment w/chicken fertilizer & forest mulch. If it's a large area, you might want to consider installing a sprinkler system (we bought a kit on-line from lawnbeltusa.com and it works great). Rake, level, and then roll out the sod like carpet. It's amazing how quickly you can go from brown dirt patch to lawn; it's really satisfying! -CG
We installed sod about four years ago. We learned so much. Make sure your sprinklers work REALLY well first. We just rototilled the soil with a lot of leaves in it. It was very inorganic sand/gravel/clay soil. The grass is still growing fine. However, we picked a very fine fescu and this is not the best climate for fescu. Half our yard is shadey and half sunny. As long as it gets water the grass does well in either sun or shade. I think it needs too much water and if I had it to do over again I would pick a less fine grass, even leaning toward a thick crab crab grass type, that doesn't need so much mowing or water. What ever type you choose be prepared for the racoons to roll up the sod every night ruining all your work for weeks. You can buy our live trap if it comes to that (540-8788). Every morning you will go out and have to stamp it down again. But in the end your grass will grow. Maybe seeds would be better (especially at this time of year) because you wouldn't have to battle the racoons, with plenty of water it grows well. Sarah
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