Our Discussions

To My Child ... or... Is This Bringing Up Loos -o -Nonor Kids?
1 ( a madar)

To my child.....

(Later on the poet contacted Madar-Pedar and mentioned the actual title is "Just for This Day".)

Just For This Day

Just for this morning,
I am going to smile whenever I see your face.
And laugh when I feel like crying.

Just for this morning,
I will let you wake up softly
all rumpled in your pajamas, and hold you close
until you are ready for the day.

Just for this morning,
I will let you choose what you want to wear,
and smile and tell you that you're beautiful

Just for this morning,
I am going to step over the laundry,
and pick you up and take you to the park to play.

Just for this morning,
I will leave the dishes in the sink
and let you help me put that 100 piece puzzle together.

Just for this afternoon,
I will unplug the television and turn off the computer
and sit with you in the garden, blowing bubbles.

Just for this afternoon,
I will not yell once, not even a tiny grumble when you scream and whine for ice cream.
And I will buy you one, if the ice cream man comes by.

Just for this afternoon,
I wont worry about what you are going to be when you grow up,
or what the future might bring.

Just for this afternoon,
I will let you help me bake cookies, and I wont stand over you
trying to 'fix' things.

Just for this afternoon,
I will take you to McDonalds,
and buy us both a happy meal, so you can have two toys.

Just for this evening,
I will hold you in my arms and tell you a story
about when you were born and how much we love you.

Just for this evening,
I will let you splash in the tub,
and not get angry when water spills all over my nice clean floor.

Just for this evening,
I will let you stay up late, while we sit on the porch swing
and count all the stars.

Just for this evening,
I will bring you a million glasses of water,
and snuggle beside you and miss my favorite TV show.

Just for this evening,
When I kneel down to pray,
I will simply be grateful for all that I have
and not ask for anything,


Just one more day.

c. 1998. Sally Meyer.

'for my children'
2 ( a pedar)

Well, I have seen a lot of these, and this time I am going to say something.

I beleive the reason we focus so much on our kids the way expressed in this piece and similar ones is that WE NEED IT; rather than our kids need it or deserve it. IMHO, this behavior hurts the kids; this is not to address kids needs and future; this is bringing up loos -o -nonor kids.


3 ( a madar)

Madar#1 , I liked your email , This is from my friend !

Thanks for making me cry this afternoon>>>>>> I felt that this was written about my life story. I am too wrapped up in the daily routines, I spend more time to make sure everything is perfect, they have eaten good dinner, done their home-work, taken a bath, have their clothes ready for tomorrow, I guess I don't spend enough time enjoying my beautiful kids and let them be kids....

Oh, wow ,,,, may be I go home early tonight and take them to the park.

Thanks for the reminder.

4 ( a madar)

I think we all need these reminders to appreciate what we have and set our priorities straight. We need to realize that kids are kids and not little adults. I think we all agree that today's life style expect a lot from a child. We ask them to keep a very tight schedule and be sharp and active at all the time. This is so unfair. Lets take a moment and look back at our childhood. Remember those free summer days. All those time you had to spend in the Kocheh with friends. Do our kids get that? Of course not. Yes there were some wasted time but lets be honest and accept that there were a lot of gains too. Look at ourselves did we fail or were we all able to make it even in a foreign country with all the difficulties?

Kids now a days have to jump from one class to another and in between they have to do their homework and other stuff we have scheduled for them. I understand that the time has changed but at the same time I think we should fight the negative aspect of it. We and our children are not robot. We all need tender loving care besides discipline and hard work.

Have a wonderful and relaxing day,

5 ( a madar)

Dear Pedar#2,

I am not sure if you have any children or not, but the way you expressed yourself shows either you don't have any children or you are one of those so called tuff Iranian fathers that don't believe on giving love to their children. Either way, you need to think a little harder when you see these kind of e.mails. In this society our children need as much love as they can get. They will be successful in life if they get the love they deserve and should be getting form their parents. This is unfortunate that you think giving love and attention will make your children to be loose va nonoor. Not giving love and attention will drive your children away from you and more toward drugs and other wrong behaviors. This starts with small children and will be even more important when they get to their teenage years. No matter how many of these types of e.mails we get and how annoying they might be to some people even if this makes one person like Madar#1 to think about this then it is worth sending and receiving these e.mails. I agree, that too much emphasis is being given to these kind of e.mails and not enough on how to make your child be more responsive to your needs as parents. Not having enough of the other kind doesn't mean we have too much of this kind. I suggest you be more proactive and educate us on what you believe to be more productive way of dealing with our children and making sure they will not be Loose va nonoor when they grow up.

6 ( madar#1)

Pedar#2 Jaan,

Knowing you and the fact that you are a father yourself, your Email made me a bit surprised. Maybe you need to explain more what you have in mind, but I hope you are not saying pay attention to our kids and loving them in a healthy way is equal to raising loos -o -nonor kids. Because I believe there is no such a thing of loving too much in any healthy relationship, especially loving kids.

7 ( a madar)

Hey now,,,,, I don't think my kids are loos-o-nonor. I just think the society puts a huge burden on parents shoulder to push their kids to be the best they can be. I don't know if Madar#1 has any kids, bit you find out that every system oushes you to be that way. Schools have high expectation and any other activity you involve your kids in is the same.

Think about it, for the most part our parents had no clue what we were doing from one day to next. Majority of us have deep feelings about not having received enough love. I think most of us try to make up for that with our children, to make sure we're always there and be extremely involved with them.

I just meant that I was going to try and find a balance in that. I do want my kids to know that I love them no matter what.

8 ( pedar#2)

Hi Madar#4,

First of all I have children.

What I am complaining about is somebody saying over and over that he/she will do what ever his/her child and himself/herslef enjoy; I am seeing it and hearing it here and there. I am not against having fun; I am not agianst advocating it either. But, I am against brining it up over and over and nothing else. There is a lack of balance, proportionality between this and other things; why not a poem about air, or earth, stars, about responsibility, or about Iran.

Balance is the key to happiness and real success. Love is not the same as loos-bAzi; it is deeper, and does not need to be said and proved in any act.

9 ( a pedar)

Hello, I am a father of three girls as Pedar#2 is. I know him such an almost a perfect father. Logical, Lovely, and a given father. He is not my best friend and I am not agree with him in all subjects specially matters of politics. But I know him and I have faith at him as a logical person with so many good points that I wish most of us could be like him. I believe him as a good person which has a lot of values to Iranian community. Therefor we are not hearing from some normal father that talks with feeling, The reason that I introduced Pedar#2 is because it is important who says what and who are we facing with? He is not a person that likes to talk or discuss a matter just because. He is an educated and lovely father and a man of life. (good for his wife)

I am 100% agree with Pedar#2. let me ask these:
Who doesn't know about Love towards the kids?
Who doesn't believe that Children are a gift of Life?
Who doesn't want to give 100% to his/her children?
Who is against all those good points and good words that are written in Madar#1's e-mail?
So touchable and emotional poem that I like to ask if you know anyone against of concept of that well written matter about loving and spending maximum time with the children.

And so many other questions of who? Who? who? ^ Doesn't believe in children and family especially among the today's generation of Iranian parents (Off course a few exception that doesn't count). there is a saying in Farsi:

Az kalaagh siaah khastand keh behtarin va khoshgeltarin bacheh rooy koreh zamin ra entekhaab bokoneh, Raft o bacheh khodesh ra Aavard!

Because Kalaagh siaah loves his/her child.

Unfortunately most of parents close their eyes and block their ears and in the name of "love" and "gift of life" destroying the future of their children. Specially in this country.

Everyone knows that we are living in "Farzand Saalaari" periode. Is not Man saalaari or woman Saalaari. However somehow farzand saalaari is in benefit of mothers but my point is : The kid's are running the families at most occasions and parents are raising so many loose and nonor kids that are so behind of life (Nesbi moghayeseh konid) in this society with all these opportunities. (Again, I am not talking about exceptions).

If you knew why at olden time parents made discipline? Then my points were more obvious. They made discipline and were tuff just because they loved their children not because they wanted to torture the children, then you would believe that how is and what is the best way of serving of the kids and what is good or bad for kids.

I apologize if my words at some points are generalized and sounds like I am justifying all parents. No, I don't mean that. I am sure so many of you are perfect parents. But I am talking towards those majority that believe everything is luck and under flag of "love" approaching self satisfaction and destroying future of their kids and then calling that "BAD SHAANSI.

10 ( a madar)

Hello For Pete's sake it was a poem, supposed to pick you up.

11 ( a madar)


1. I think (the email of Madar#4 in the topic of "Killing Defenseless People ... Is It a Parenting Issue? " ) was well to the point showing that she cares and at the same time she doesn't want to see these pictures; I don't see what is wrong with that.

2. It is disappointing to see your recommendation: "maybe the solution is not to be on the mailing list". You don't want to hear a voice differnet from yours? Unfortunately this is a characterisitc of our society as a whole.

3. Let me clarify a little bit what I meant in my first & second emails regarding the poem:

A. I don't have any statistics, but from many poeple that I know, I have noticed that the young Iranians who came to this coutnry 25-15 years ago are in general very successful. I am talking about those who came here when they were 15-20 and I know some who came just by themselves at very young age like 15. I have seen some of them to be engineering managers in their twentees. It is not only the professional success: I have found them normally very polite and considerate people.

In contrast, I have seen a much bigger number of Iranina children grwoing up in this country with their parents. These are the ones borne here or came here at very young age: less than 10. I see most of these kids impolite, lazy, loos, and thoes who if are not your own children could make your blood to boil in seconds, and you wish in the bottom of your heart you could slap them in the face.

Now, this is an important issue; how do you deal with that? The child that you make all the sacrifices for does not study; colors his hair, drinsk, etc. This is the context I read the poem. Kiss your kid, give him/her whatever you can afford: raise a monster that everybody can recognize at early age except for those who are closest.

B. Several years ago, in Turkey, I met someone whom some might know was one of big book publishers in Iran. I was playing with my daughter who was only a few months old; the age that kid is totally innocent, no loosbAzi, nothing. Noramlly in these situations you might hear some nice, friendly comments from people around you, and nothing else. But not from Mr. Zavvarl; without any warning, or anything he said : I hate loos kids! It was totally unfair of him; nevertheless, his comment stuck like glue to my mind; maybe I couldn't forget it because it was so unfair. But, of course I can't agree with him more.

C. As I said in my previous email I am not against having fun, and spending time, or even occassionally loosing the kids - and as a matter of fact I do that myself because I enjoy it. But, I am worried about the next generation; I can't toleate their intollerance, their selfishness, and we need to do more than just loosing them.

That's it for now.

12 ( madar#10)

Dear Pedar#11,

I am one of those 16 years old who came here and some time I translate English straight to Farsi and it does not come out correctly and as one person mentioned it's hard to transfer the tone of voice and facial expression over the e-mail.

Anyway If I offended anybody I did not meant to.

Back to the discussion of spoil kids, I am not sure I am understanding what you mean exactly but I get a feeling you saying the Iranian kids raised here are spoil.

I think you are too hard on just Iranian parents. I don't believe raising the spoil children has anything too do with where you live or what background you come from.

Some parents let other factors make their parenting decisions instead of going with the what is right or wrong, not setting a good example for their kids is one. for example in my personal opinion is if you drink or smoke yourself how could you tell your kids not to do the same things. Also I think some us trying to be a good parents by giving our kids all the things that we did not have as kids for whatever reason (like good parents who had sense not to spoil their kids). I think giving kids too many things like their own TV, all kind of video games or phone line in their bed rooms, letting kids to go to mall without adult supervision, let a 11 year kid watching R rated movies are creating spoil kids not hugging and kissing. Being involved with your kids life and know their friends and their parents friends, know what going on at their school, show up for their games win or lose are the things that make a difference.

I am sure we all know at least a family that their kid/kids are so out of control but because we are so polite as a culture we would not say anything because we don't want to heard the parents feeling. I personally might not have the guts to say anything but for sure I will minimize our contact with the family and point out to my kids that this type of behavior is not acceptable and don't even think about acting like that.

On my suggestion of not being on the mailing list it was just a suggestion not an order, for people who don't want get all the e-mails just go the to web page and check the area that they are interested and participate only in those discussion. It did not meant to that I did not want to hear from a voice different from mine.


I just remembered a story that one of the guys at work was telling us about his mom.

His sister was in 9th grade and she wanted something and the mother said no, but she started to talk in baby talk and try to get her mom to say yes, the mother warned her about acting like a baby she did not quite. The next morning at the bus stop were mother holding the daughter hands while the daughter was force to keep a pacifaior in her mouth. Mom told the other kids that her daughter is acting like baby so she is treating her like one!

He has a lots of stories like that.

Please send your replies and/or opinions regarding this subject to madar-pedar@surya.eecs.berkeley.edu.

Back to madar-pedar