I may not have expressed this too well, but any insights or suggestions will be appreciated. I have a thick skin and so can take criticism if warranted.

I have a stubborn kid, too, still stubborn at 7 although better than he was at 3. Your daughter does sound like an extra handful though. First of all, see if you can get a book (from your local library) called "Your Three Year Old." This is part of a series written some years ago by a couple of psychologists and I have found it very useful in dealing with the psychological changes that happen as children grow older.

In the case of my son I am a single parent with no other support, so I really had to choose my battles to avoid getting totally flattened. If my son wanted to eat cereal every night for dinner for two months, that's what he ate. When we got into a fight in the morning about getting dressed warmly enough, I took him outside to feel the cool air, then he was usually good about dressing warmly enough.

The only advice I can offer you is to try to give your daughter a choice as much as possible, but not an unlimited choice. And as much as possible you make her decide, in a timely manner. So when you are fixing her hair, ask her how many ponytails she wants. When it is time to get dressed (and don't, by the way, say "Time to get dressed.") ask her to choose between pants and a dress. For dinner, you might offer her what the family is eating, or give her one other easy to fix option, such as cereal, make her decide, then stick with it.

Hope this helps Dianna

I empathize with you because it is difficult to deal with her type of temperament on a daily basis. You become worn down by the constant battles. I think it will get better if you and your family members recognize what is happening and make the necessary changes. Your daughter is really not "out to get you" although it may feel that way. She has her own reasons for her behavior. The key is finding what works for her and you and that takes time, energy and searching. It is an on-going process. You are beginning a journey that you didn't expect to take so the best thing to do is to educate yourself about temperament issues. You've taken the first step by asking for help. I wish you the best.

Sharon

Helen

Barbara

And while, yes, it's true you need to pick your battles, it's hard because you do have to be the parent. We've tried to provide our son with as many choices as possible but even that it hard (a really basic and even lame example: "You can wear these shoes or those shoes, but you cannot go barefoot." "NO! I want no shoes!" "Well . . . Here are your choices, you wear these shoes or those shoes." All of this repeated ad infinitum and nauseum.) Sometimes, I have found it comes down to who will cave in first, but since we're BOTH stubborn it can go on for too long. And it's frustrating. Then it becomes more of who will win then what shoes, or clothes or whatever. Yuck!

Just remember these kids are working really hard to establish order and some control in their lives (not that you don't provide any, but they need to "own" something). A new baby will add even more pressure, but I'm sure you know that already! :-)

Unfortunately, many, many, too many times we have even had to resort to threats, albeit calm ones: Ok, listen to me, if you do not cooperate with me on this than that means I won't read you a story tonight/take you to the park/whatever we know he might be keen on doing. Actually, I think he's beginning to understand this . . . it's working! Though sometimes it takes 5 or 6 tries. We're trying to emphasize that we're all in this together. It's been real important to keep the follow-through, whether it's the punishment or reward. When the calm reasoning tact doesn't work, and he's screaming and kicking and hitting, then we banish him to his room or to go sit on the couch until he can calm down. It's hard on the ears and psyche for us. Sometimes I have even had to sit on the floor forcibly hold him in my lap when the tantrum gets out of hand and wait, blocking out sound as best I can, until the storm subsides.

We keep repeating to ourselves that this age will pass. He's a bright and charming kid. And he's practicing for adolescence. If we can successfully deal with this, then we've got some practice for what may come ahead. A side note: my brother was exactly like this as a child and extremely intellectually combative as a teenager; now upon reflection he says that he never really learned how to deal with his emotions and he's had a hard time as an adult in learning to give up wanting control and running everything around him (our parents always gave in).

Remember we're trying to prepare our kids to survive without us. Sometimes we have to be "unfair," but we're the only ones who can really show them. And, of course, each one is so different. I know it's hard. We love our kids, just not everything they do or how they do it. Good luck! You will make it.

Natasha

First, don't forget the most important fact that you slipped in toward the end of your e-mail: you're about to have another baby. Your son remained the first-born when your daughter was born. She's about to lose her baby status and being the middle child just doesn't offer much cachet. Particularly if #3 is also a girl, it's going to be hard for her to find a new place and she needs huge amounts of reassurance and attention -- more, perhaps, than seems reasonable or evident from her not-very-attractive way of asking for it.

Second, remember the One True Comfort of Parenthood: nothing, NOTHING, about your children doesn't change. It WILL get better, though it sounds as if you'll always have an independent thinker in this one.

Beyond that, it sounds to me like both you and your mother-in-law are right: you can and should give on the little things but there are many big things that you can't give on. When my now-9 year-old went through a phase like this (also when she was adapting to a new baby in the family), I did use three approaches very consistently. First, I almost always spoke rationally to her, no matter how crazy she got. I continued to treat her like a small person with a mind, even though all I was getting back was irrationality and emotion (not an easy task of course!). Second, I was very, very firm on certain things (can't go outside naked, must sit at the table at mealtimes) and always explained my behavior in the same way: that my job as a Mommy was to make sure she was safe and healthy, to teach her how to be the person she can be, and that NOTHING was going to get in the way of my doing that job, that I would be a bad Mommy if I didn't do it. (In other words, I tried not to make it about what I wanted versus what she wanted, but rather about our roles: that my job was to set certain limits and enforce certain rules. Her job was to figure out how to live by those rules, including expressing her discontent if that was what she needed to do. But that in the end, my way would win because I was the grown-up and it was my responsibility.) Last, I always reminded her that she had a choice about her own behavior and reaction to these situations: a choice that came to be known in our family shorthand as "the hard way or the easy way." If she refused to sit in her chair, I would explain the consequences: "Ellen, you are going to sit in your chair. We can do this the hard way or the easy way, it's up to you. You can kick and scream and cry, in which case I will pick you up and put you in your chair and hold you down if I have to. Or you can get up yourself, and sit in the chair on your own. It's up to you." Of course, you have to be willing to enforce this, which seems cruel sometimes, but must be done. And it does have an effect, particularly if you're very consistent--almost ritualistic--about your language. I think they learn to say to themselves as soon as they hear certain words "oh, this is one of those" and they stop on their own, which is of course what you're trying to teach them. One wierd side benefit of this is that years later, if the words "we can do this the hard way or the easy way" slip out of my mouth (which they rarely do), they have an almost supernatural effect -- the kids stop dead in their tracks and re-evaluate their tactics!

Finally, don't worry too much about breaking her spirit. I used to hate forcing my daughter and felt like a monster sometimes (though reminding her that she had the power to stop me, by changing her behavior, helped me at least as much as it did her), but I definitely did NOT break her spirit, as those out there who know her will testify! It seems clear poverty and injustice break the spirit, firm limits imposed consistently and rationally by loving parents do not.

Oh, and don't forget counting (I'm going to count to ten and then you will put on your dress. one, two...). I never figured out why this works but all my friends agree it seems to have some mystical effect.

Good luck with this one and with #3!!

Nina

In the single-parents support group now going on through CARE, the facilitator lent me a book entitled something like "Parenting Your StrongWilled Child" (I will try to send you the exact title and author's names next week ... ) Anyway, the book is GREAT! It is very very pragmatic. It has all the theoretical "rap," but, much more useful is the five-week practical program for learning new parenting strategies.

I have found this program helpful. Not a cure-all ... nothing will change the fact that my daughter (and yours, it sounds) are very strongwilled. This will help them a lot later in life -- being strong-willed is a very useful trait for adults, for succeeding in business, athletics, finance, etc. ... but a little SHAPING of it is needed! Get the book, really, I bet it will help! :-)

Mary Carol

I too began to feel terribly guilty about the fact that, although I loved him to death, I couldn't feel that I LIKED his personality very much. It was just so exhausting.

It often seemed like he acted that way out of habit, and I wanted him to be more aware of how he was behaving. So, I tried talking to him about: 1) how "big kids" need to act (very effective because he took great pride in being a big kid); and 2) how he didn't HAVE TO be so contrary (like the time that I told him at 2 yrs old that he didn't HAVE TO cry every time he woke up in the morning--it was like a revelation for him, and he never did it again.) I know I shouldn't expect a three year old to be very introspective, but it was worth a try.

I don't know if it sank in, or if he just outgrew his contrariness, but I do have an encouraging outcome. Somehow things just got a lot better when he turned four. He became much more reasonable and AGREEABLE! (Part of that might be due to a desire to outshine his little sister.) Now that he's five, his Kindergarten teacher reported to us that he's doing great and he's a leader in class discussions! Plus, I have newfound pleasure in his company.

So, take heart and be reassured that your little one's independence could be the beginnings of a future leader. Good luck!

Chen Yin

Marisa

Actually I'm prone to agree with your mother-in-law. Let her pick her own clothes and how she wears her hair. Give her choices (within reason) as to what food she eats but be firm on the order she eats it -- "real" food first, then sweets. No real food, no sweets. Be firm with safety issues of seat belts, etc. Our son has always been included in decisions about his life as well as ours. We also have been clear in that there are some decisions that adults have the final say so but he is welcome to give in put. It wasn't easy to give up control over him especially when we were in a rush and doing it for him was faster and easier and explanations as to WHY things needed to be done a certain way were difficult and time consuming. The hardest part was letting him suffer the consequences of inappropriate decisions like not wearing a coat when it was cold (and we told him he needed one but he chose not to take one). But at almost 7 yrs old, he is much more responsible than a lot of his peers seem to be and makes surprisingly good decisions the majority of the time about his life.

Kay

I've just read the summary of other suggestions (which are terrific) and would like to add a few games:

1. "Get your clothes and come over to my room so we can play a game while we get dressed. Which one do you want to play today?"
   a. Race. Who can get dressed first?
   b. "Can you put on something.....blue?" "Put something on your right foot." "Put on something that will be covered up." This works well to sometimes get very silly: "Put something on your ear, backwards, etc."
   c. Put something on and I'll try to guess what it is. (Guess silly!)
   d. You tell me what to put on.
   
2. Opposite game. You say, "sit", she stands. You say, "open eyes", she closes them. Then let her have a turn to give you directions. Get silly.
3. Let her be the boss, perhaps at the playground and she tells you what to do. Eventually, you behave the way she behaves at home: tantrum, run the opposite direction, not doing what she tells you to. Then you model changing your mind and cooperating with her. Verbalize what you are thinking and show her a way to back down.

   Another advantage of this game is that she has your full attention. With a baby coming, she needs that. Also talk to her about what having a new baby will mean to her life.

Any lastly, minimize the problem situation by focusing on the coming activity. "After we're dressed, we can go to the park. What are you going to do the first thing?"

Sometimes it seemed as if I played games all day. I still remember when my son caught on and named them, "Mommy tricks," but they worked for years.

Having fun, being silly, enjoying each other, time will pass. Good luck.

Barbara

The basic premise is that kids just want to be understood and that the best thing to teach them is how to best express their feelings. I've been putting it into practice with my stubborn 2-yr old and I see it making a difference. For example, one afternoon, while running from one store to the other, getting in and out of the car, being in a rush, and hearing "no, you can't have/do that" for the nth time, my son "lost it" when I refused to let him climb out of the shopping cart "by mysewf". So I scooped my screaming child off the parking lot pavement and forced him into the carseat, something I really hate doing. Anyhow, as we pulled away and he was crying, I started to say, "You wanted to climb out of the cart yourself, didn't you?" Crying turned to sniffles, "Yeah!", "You wanted Mommy to get you a gumball and she said No! You're _angry_ that Mommy said you couldn't have a gumball!" More sniffles, much calmer, "Yeah!" And we continued like this all the way home. A few minutes later, Elie approached my partner and very emphatically said, "Daddy, I wanted a gumball and Mommy wouldn't let me have it!" Daddy was shocked to hear this kind of talk coming from a little one, but I explained to him what happened and noted that he was much calmer and had been charming and cooperative since the point where his feelings were acknowledged. We also averted a major tantrum.

Sophie

Joyce

ON a more cheery note, we also play around my daughter's need to be the one in control, in very structured ways (e.g. NOT EVER around meals, getting dressed, leaving the house, taking a bath). Remember the old game of "statue" where everyone has to freeze in whatever odd pose? Well, Alicia saw this on TV awhile ago and even at 22 months, she "got" it. We put on the radio and I dance and whenever she pushes the "off" button I have to freeze (with one foot in the air, or one arm flung out or some other silly pose) while she laughs and laughs until she turns the music back on. If she doesn't do it right away, I yell "help! help!" in a goofy way, while staying "frozen" This makes her laugh even harder.

We also play with tickling ... where I say "I'm going to tickle your neck" (or belly, or knee) and she either lets me or says "NO." If she says "NO" I stop. Then she laughs and says "OK." ( I think, BTW, this is good training to help kids know that they have a right to set limits around being touched)

Also we sing. That is, I sing. She names the song. Often, I'll be halfway through the first verse and she'll name a different song. I change songs. This can go on for like 15 minutes, with her calling the shots. It's kind of aggravating, actually, but I go along with it goodnaturedly. These little exercises in allowing her a sense of power seem, in some odd way, to make her more amenable when I say, "OK. Please go to the table and sit down. Time to eat." or whatever.

Does anyone else out there do this kind of play with their kids?

Mary Carol

I was particularly struck by your comment about other parents and other children. I always say that my child of this type has made me humble. I had thought I was a great parent, my kids were models of adjustment, naturally a result of my sensitive parenting. They were normally independent, stubborn, and willful, but they grew out of it, they responded like the parenting books said they would (should). And, of course, I took credit. Once I began to become unglued by my third child, I naturally despaired of my parenting skills. However, over time, I have come to believe that there really is this temperment difference between kids (and people).

Our family is still not predictably successful in dealing with my now nine year old spirited child. He brings incredible drama to our lives in many ways, not all pleasant. However, I am trying not to take it as my parenting failure (even though it is often embarassing) and I am trying (with more success than not) when I am at the end of my rope to remember the great joy and pleasure he brings us. This seems simple, but it has de-escalated some of the stress around this stuff for me.

(I think the the choose-your-battles issue is what separates these kids from the others: they make EVERYTHING a battle. Even when you let them choose.)

Good luck! (And maybe we can all get together again for lunch time support and stories.)

Emily