Making good for teen's theft from elderly relative

I am writing for some friendly responses to my quandary--sometimes I find the responses here very harsh. In a moment of Severely Lapsed Judgement, my teen stole some good liquor in beautiful old bottles from a very elderly relative's house which he visits regularly (and loves). He threw out the wonderful bottles and transferred the alcohol into plastic bottles with an eye to transporting it more easily and giving some hypothetical friends a treat at a future occasion of some kind. We have already gone through all the hard and sad discussions re: matters of trust, respect, legality, choosing friends, personal character, etc. etc. etc. at great length over some time. My question is about how to make good at this point. I thought he could use his savings to buy new bottles of what he took and put them back next time he's there. But he might not remember exactly, this wouldn't get this relative back the elegant old stuff, and the new bottles might call attention to the fact that something's gone on on that shelf that no one might notice otherwise (relative doesn't drink, can't physically get to where the liquor is kept, will likely never know). Or, he could put the old alcohol into new bottles? Or he's already ruined it by putting it in plastic? And what to do with what he stole? He should have to pour it out? Or... Please share your thoughts about what you think would be wise and fair. Wanting to Be Wise and Fair

An apology may well be enough making good for relative. If not the relative can say what else would be. Unless there is an issue of cognitive decline in the relative, then I think this is the way you should go. If there is, and the relative might not understand or get unduly upset, then your son needs to think about another way to make good. Do something special with the relative, or donate the value of the liquor to a cause that is important to him.

Replacing the liquor in any way is more about hiding the misdeed than making good, in my opinion, if not paired with a confession and apology.

Good luck to you. These things are hard. But it should be hard on your son - these are the incidents that make us who we are. Have had my share of hard apologies to make

He made the choice to steal, let him see how his actions affect the relative when he/she knows. Let him feel the response of the other person. It could be bad, could be good, could be both. It could change. After anger there could be sadness, forgiveness. A rich lesson. He needs to take responsibility to confess and ask the person he wronged what he can do to restore her trust. You can talk to him until you're blue in the face, he can experience your reaction in the bubble of his home, but to restore the situation to equilibrium I think he has to tell. You could go with him for support but let him talk. He'll be a better person for it.

It's irrelevant that the person can't reach the shelf and could be easily fooled. The fact that you are latching onto these things shows that you value your son's comfort over doing what's right. Maybe deep down you know you're protecting him from his own actions, maybe that's why you asked people to be kind. For what it's worth, all parents of teenagers including myself have been there or someplace worse with their kids. anon

Good luck. It's hard to do the right thing, but your son will be infinitely better off in the long run and you will be more content. Wanting you to be wise and fair

Your elderly relative will be very disappointed in your son, but this relative has probably lived and seen enough to know that teens do stupid and bad things sometimes. Also, your son needs to own up to this. If he is too mortified to deal with this face to face, then all the more reason he should do it. This can be a real learning experience for him.

I would come down VERY hard on him so he knows not to ever push these limits with you again. My philosophy is that if you go too soft with kids on the first serious infraction, then they will play you in the future.

- First, ask your son what HE thinks would be sufficient to ''make good''. If need be, give him some time (a day or two) to think about it. You may be (pleasantly) surprised at what he comes up with; when asked, children often suggest harsher consequences or punishments for their actions than parents are considering.

- Second, what YOUR stance should be is this: what he did was wrong, regardless of the ''reasons'', and deeply disrespectful and unloving to the elderly relative he ''visits regularly and loves''. He took advantage of them, plain and simple. If stating this causes him some pain, that is a GOOD thing. There is such a thing as ''appropriate shame''. In my view, he should have to tell this relative and accept the fallout of his actions. Your son is preparing for adult life, and dealing with the consequences of his actions is part of that preparation - something he'll need to do for the rest of his life. He might as well begin to assemble a skill set now.

As for what to do with the liquor - that is mostly a side issue, and I feel is distracting from the real issue - his actions. The liquor belongs to the elderly relative, and should be returned to them!!

I hope I don't sound harsh - what I wish to convey is that a direct, no-nonsense and matter-of-fact (adult!) attitude is what's important here. And also that what your son may LEARN from this experience is what will make it ''good'', in the long run.

p.s. Please find, and read, Michael Gurian's ''A Fine Young Man'' - AWESOME book on how to raise adolescent boys! - parenting is not a popularity contest

The more important issue lies with why this teen has committed theft and underaged drinking. What is the teen communicating by such behavior? What if they had not been caught? Has this behavior occurred before? Good luck! eye on the bigger picture

By working with your child to extend the deception into either assuming that the relative won't notice, or tricking them with different bottles the lesson you teach is 1) that you will fix what your son has done wrong, and 2) deception is okay if it preserves appearances and family peace.

Telling the truth might not feel great in the short term, but it is a valuable long term lesson. Lying and stealing isn't made right by pretending it didn't happen. honesty is the best policy

To you and to your son, what would feel like making amends? Grocery shopping for this person, or cleaning house? Or if nothing seems quite right for this person, perhaps your son could volunteer at a soup kitchen or in some other way offer help for the elderly over the holidays. Perhaps he could use some of his money to make a food basket (which counters the theft aspect). And perhaps a note of apology to *you* might be appropriate. Good luck

Instead, how about just putting in some quality time with this relative--maybe reading to him or going through old family photos and describing their content out loud. If even this is too disruptive, the teen can ''pay it forward'' by going to a nursing home and donating volunteer hours in whatever way the home needs. Alternatively, he can work weekends making money doing lawn work or washing cars until $100 is saved and then donate that to an elderly cause of his choice. Or to a charity that this old relative would want helped.

The point is for the teen to do the inner work of remorse, so these other acts can also symbolize that. Best of luck. lane

I also have family members with significant memory and cognitive impairment. My suggestion to you does not change because this actually has more to do with your son making amends for what he did and less to do with how the victim responds. When you do something to harm someone else the apology you give is an actor contrition acknowledging for yourself that you did wrong. Ultimately you can't control how someone responds to that apology regardless of their cognitive status.

Finally, your elderly relative may or may not understand what it being said. People speak to individuals who are comatose in the hope that they might hear. If your son is truly sorry for what he did his honest confession and apology can be made with the hope that he is understood because he wants to communicate that information, the resulting understanding is less important. do right because it is right

Years ago, my son was was given a year sentence for a crime he committed. He's a good kid, very soft, and sometimes does not make good decisions. I knew he would never survive prison, he would not come out the same.

Without getting into the details of how we did it, he was given a year of probation in exchange. He was to work at a homeless shelter EVERYDAY, rain or shine.

He got up every morning before the sun, caught the bus, and was at the shelter by 6:30 AM (including weekends). He did his 1 hr of work, caught the bus and went to school. In the beginning he absolutely miserable - hated it, but over time, by the end of the year it became a very positive part of his life.

After his probation period, he continued to work/volunteer at the shelter for many years. Now he is now an adult. A very kind, caring, hard working person, and of course law abiding.

The shelter made a positive impact on my son's life. I am so happy things turned out the way they did anon

Daughter's unauthorized charges to our credit card

Many months ago, my daughter asked to purchase something on Amazon using my debit card. It was a very reasonable purchase, and I personally placed my card number in her account for the purchase. Recently, my husband and I are were looking over a bank statement (which we don't do all that often together) and found multiple Amazon charges that we didn't recognize. It is coming to light only now because, as it turns out, he had thought they were my purchases, and I had thought they were his, and we are each fine with that. I called Amazon and had my number deleted from her account, which I had not done (and didn't think way back then I needed to - my mistake) but now, when I do the math, our kid has charged, slowly over many months, a total of over $1500 worth of items. She's 17 and a senior in high school. I plan to bring this to her attention, and think it reasonable to be paid back because, as far as my husband and I are concerned, these were unauthorized. Before doing so, I'd like to ask my fellow parents-of-teens for your take on this. What to say? What terms to reach? She may deny/pretend/act that she knew what was going on and/or actually believe that these were legitimate charges. I never learned anything about good money management from my own parents, and want to do better by my own kids. We giver her a reasonable amount of money at the start of every month for her clothing/books/food and we pay for all appropriate life expenses, anything school related, and so on. She has worked over the summer, saved up some money, and has a savings account that she has spent many years building up. I'd really like advice on both the big financial picture and the specifics of how to deal with this particular, unique situation before I discuss this Amazon issue with her. Needing a little Suze Orman

You can give her an opportunity to explain her behavior and ask her how much she thinks she spent. Then show her the actual amount and go through the charges together. This is how freshmen in college end up charging up their credit cards, so it's a good lesson for her now. Ask her to propose a way to pay ALL of it back. She can use her savings, she can do chores, she can turn over half her paychecks for a certain period of time. Ask if the items she bought still feel worth it. Can any be returned? Explain that this would be considered theft if the card belonged to a boss, a friend, a grandparent, etc. so you take it very seriously and this needs to be an experience she remembers for the rest of her life.

You can do all this kindly but firmly. But make sure it hurts a bit. This is a serious amount of money and a serious breach of trust. And make sure the payment plan will finish before she goes off to college.

It's hard to give your kids painful consequences, but your actions will give her an important life lesson. Which lesson do you want it to be? That there are no consequences? Or that being responsible/honest is the way to go? Try to steer by that. When she's fifty years old, the $1500 she's going to pay back will not seem like so much, but the lesson she learns will still be part of her. wow! $1500!

I also allow them from time to time to use my credit card instead of their debit card because the purchase they're making is one I would have paid for anyway (school clothes, shoes, text books). They know to ask first. I also get a notice from Amazon every time a purchase is made. For other vendors I complete the transaction for them.

If your daughter thought you approved of the use of your card, or thought she was using her own account, I would focus on fixing the situation for the future. If she knew you didn't approve I would have her pay you back over time, particularly if she has money from working. You might consider having her repay half of the amount, and get her a debit card for future purchases so she has more control and responsibility. That will also further your goal of teaching her financial responsibility. Parent of semi-financially literate teens

14-year-old billed $300 for shoplifting at Walgreens

My 14 year old son was caught shoplifting Skittles in a Walgreen. They called me, and let him go upon my request. Today I received a $300 bill from a law office in Florida, asking that I settle this Civil matter with them within 20 days. It seems like (and looks like) a scam to me, and I really don't have the $300 right now. But I also don't want to ignore it and have it get worse or cost more later. Any experience or helpful advise about this? Thank you. Scammed?

If the store ''let him go on your request'' and you didn't pick him up, perhaps there's something the store required that your child should have told you about. However, call the store. Find out what their policy is. Then you'll be able to decide if the law firm's letter is legitimate.

Personally, I was glad that my daughter got caught (on video tape which we sat and watched with her) and had to face stiff consequences. Stealing is not a behavior that's acceptable in our family. She found out that the broader world isn't cool with it, either. At the same time, we were glad the store handled her shoplifting internally--instead of turning it over to the police.

If it helps you feel better, have a lawyer write a letter on your behalf. Earlier this year, I wrote a letter to Macy's Loss Prevention on behalf of a client and she wasn't hassled again. Good luck! Criminal Defense Attorney

i am close to a few families (friends' kids) that have been caught stealing and what i have seen lately is a certain lack of consequences for the kids. and every one of my kids has had some police ''attention''...

Lets not use excuses like: ''adults get away with much worse offenses'' which i heard from one mom, making excuses for her kid's larceny. Citizen at Large

I suspect my 14-y-o is shoplifting - consequences? Nov 2009

I suspect that my 14 year old daughter has shoplifted. Can't prove it, so I can't confront her. However, if she has, chances are she will again. I'd like to know what happens when a minor is caught shoplifting. I assume the store would hold her and call me (if I'm not in the store already). In Alameda County, does it go to the District Attorney's office or somewhere else? I do hope I'm wrong. Suspicious

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when my daughter was 21, in college, she confessed to me that a couple of years before she shoplifted a pair of expensive designer jeans at Nordstroms. I was shocked of course. (She has always liked nice clothes & now, at 25, spends a fortune on them.) As time goes on she has confessed in passing how she shoplifted quite a bit from stores like Target and the stores on Telegraph Avenue. Of course I had NO IDEA EVER that this was going on.Parents simply do not know! Do I wish she had gotten picked up for it? YES. I wish they had caught her and do whatever the legal consequences are. This is wrong & I don't think as parents WE can do that much about it. Fortunately store security is much better than it was back then so your chances of getting caught are higher I think. Mom of former teen shoplifter

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My daughter, who is actually a very responsible, nice kid, was caught shopllifting TWICE. The first time, at 14, Target caught her and two friends. We had to pick her up, sign papers that said she couldn't come into the store again without an adult, and pay back the amount plus expenses of the store's time, several hundred dollars. My daughter was upset but defiant re the store not needing the money anyhow. We made her pay us back, explained how we strongly disagreed with her philosophy re capitalism (!), had her stop hanging out with those guys, and told her if it ever happened again, she'd be in BIG trouble. I thought that was it. A year later, I got a call from Nordstrom's in SF and I had to go into the city and pick her up. They did much the same thing as Target. In front of the girls, I asked if the police could keep her overnight...and boy was I ready for them to take her. But they don't do that. I also told them how embarrassed I was that kids who have so much could steal. My daughter looked stricken. We took BART home and I barely said a word to her. At home, I expressed my disbelief and told her how horrible it was for me. She said she was truly sorry, that she'd done a ''really stupid'' thing and never never again. This time, she seemed to understand. So she worked for us to pay it back and was grounded for a while, and no shopping for a month. That was it, and my daughter has grown into a respectable citizen! Relieved Mom

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If your child is caught shop lifting the store may or may not press charges. I have recently had some experience with this. My son was caught along with some other teens shoplifting at Safeway. They called me to come and pick him up. I actually asked them to press charges and they would not. I have suspected him of shoplifting for awhile and I warned him that I would have no sympathy if he got caught. I told him I would let them arrest him and put him in jail so he was forewarned. Now if they are caught stealing somehing that is illegal for them to have (alcohol) that is a different story. My son got a warning that he could not go into a safeway for 6 months and I had to sign a piece of paper stating that I was aware I may have a fine to pay ranging from $50.00 to $500.00. Be creative, find some way to talk to your teen about shop lifting without accusing them of it. MAke sure she knows what you plan on doing if she ever thinks of trying it and good luck. keeping one step ahead

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Daughter's friend is shoplifting - what to do?

My 14 year old daughter came home from hanging out with friends along Telegraph and told us that her friend shoplifted at a store. The friend's rationalization was that it won't go on her permanemt record because she is under 18 and she would only spent 2 nights in Juvenile hall if caught. We told our daughter to never go into a store with that friend again in case she gets caught up in a potential arrest. Now we are wondering if we should do more. Should we banish this friend? Disallow outings on Telegraph? Tell the girl's parents? I looked up this subject online and could only find tips for if your own child shoplifts. Anonymous

Another thing I ask myself about talking to other parents: How would I like to be addressed if my child were to do something wrong? Obviously I don't want to be blamed or have someone talk down to me. So I would be careful to adopt a tone of ''I felt that you would like to know this, I know it would concern me if it were my child. What do you think we should say to our kids about this, if you agree that it is a problem.'' I would enlist the other parent as an ally if I could. I had a parent call me once to tell me about some behavior of my son's that she perceived as wrong. This behavior did not seem problematic to me. Her tone in speaking to me implied that I was naive or permissive or... a bad mom. Subsequently she called back to apologize, because she realized that she had crossed a line. So I would be careful not to adopt a superior attitude. But do let the parents know, I think. part of the parents' community

Where your most important influence lies is in your relationship with her, which allows for discussions in which you share your feelings, thoughts and values with her, and open space for her to share hers with you. This will help you evaluate her maturity, her judgment, and her ability to withstand negative peer pressure. You may look at her disclosure in this instance as a test - she may be thinking (consciously or unconsciously) - how will my parent(s) react? Can I talk to my parent and share both sides of my ambivalence? Can I share my confusion? I know stealing is wrong, but what if my friend's reasoning kind of makes sense to me - can I explore this with my parents without feeling like the discussion is going to get shut down with anger or moralizing? She may also want you to provide more structure or limits, such as not allowing her to go to Telegraph.

I encourage you to provide positive reinforcement to your daughter for sharing this, and use it as a way to be in an ongoing conversation with her about her social world, the moral/ethical challenges or dilemmas she and her friends face, whether it be about dating, peer relationships, drinking, drugs, driving, cheating etc.

Some parents find it useful to have their teen's friends over to their home a few times before the teen is are allowed to go and ''hang out'' with the new friends in an unstructured way. Some parents who do not feel it realistic or sustainable to impose stringent restrictions on their teens as they get older, use a sort of buddy system, where if their teen is going to be with two trusted friends who are well-known to the parents, then the teen is allowed to also hang out with new friends. Many parents find it useful to confer with other parents for support and sharing information. Best of luck to you and your family. Ilene D

Strategy to deal with first time teen shoplifting?

Looking for any advice to deal with 16-year-old on first instance of shoplifting; appropriate consequences... is some sort of counseling warranted if no other evidence of potentially dangerous behavior? Have heard it is a fairly common thing and don't want to overreact but meanwhile want to be extremely clear about it being unacceptable and also try to understand if there is something else going on that would lead to the behavior in an otherwise non-problem child (good grades, study habits, friends, etc.). Also are there steps that should be taken to minimize any negative legal/record issues that might follow? How to emphasize to a teen the seriousness of the situation? Anonymous

Consequences? Several possibilities.

Shame and embarrassment are almost always enough. Do some research...make sure the friends are a good group. Have your kid write a letter to the store to apologize. And then show your kid you love and trust them.

Regarding legal stuff...let your kid know they are keeping track...and once might have been interesting/exciting...the second time would be stupid and totally not worth it.

I think a lot of us have done the same thing...at least once, whether its shoplifting, white lies returning an item, personal calls on work time, etc. Good luck. Yours Truly, Perfectly Human

First ask your child to tell you all the details of what happened. Assure your child that you will not involve other parents, the school or anyone else. Then,

1. Get the items which were lifted.

2. Call the retail establishment anonymously and ask a manager if they will arrest your child if you bring your child in to return the items. If they agree not to arrest or prosecute, set a time to bring your child in to return the items. Ask the manager to speak with your child about the seriousness of the issue and to tell your child that many places have cameras which catch such actions on film (these statements are true, by the way. And if you don't take the items back, you are an accessory to the crime!).

3. Take your child in to talk with the manager. Be prepared to leave quickly if the manager steps out of line. Leave the items with the manager or make your child pay the manager for the items.

4. Ground the child for one week to school, work and activities ONLY with friends whom you are certain are not the friends who pressured your child to do this. Otherwise restrict activities with any peers for a week.

5. Tell your child you forgive them, love them and know that they will not make the same mistake again.

Move on. ALL teenagers make mistakes. I imagine you did, too. My bet is that your child will move away quickly on his/her own from any peers involved. That's what our experience was. Anonymous

17-year-old daughter needs help with stealing

I am the Dad of a seventeen year old who is on the verge of a criminal life. She is a wonderful girl and widely liked by adults and has a group of close friends. Problem is since kindergarten, my daughter has had sticky fingers, and I even have a note from her kindergarten teacher, back east at a private school, about her taking things that did not belong to her.

My ex and I share 50-50 custody and my ex lives in shared housing, We have discovered that for 6 mos. my daughter had starting ordering jeans and shoes on line using the credit card number of one of the people who lives in the house. Without getting into details, this is not the first incident of calculated stealing and I know its a matter of time before she goes to prison. So we live in Albany and it would be great to find an excellent therapist for my child. in that general part of town. She is agreeably to going into therapy. She is very smart and needs someone who can hopefully do cognitive therapy. I almost think some people have chemical imbalances that predispose them to theft. I dunno since I can't explain why she does this and seems to feel compelled to steal.

Another issue is that her mum has paid the roomate the large amount of money spent on credit card fraud and is not requiring that my daughter pay her back- since where will she get the money- since her school work interfers with ability to work. When I mention consequences are necessary for this behavior, my ex accuses me of going negative and so guess who gets alienated and painted as the bad guy.Please any comments in addition to therapy referrals would be helpful. Her Dad

In addition to parenting, your daughter, at 17, is on the threshhold of leaving home, which marks another big change in your family structure and relationships. This inevitable and much anticipated milestone can increase anxiety in both teen and parent!

You also note that your daughter has had a history of stealing and wonder about compulsive behavior perhaps fueled by a chemical imbalance. I agree that these, too, would be very useful questions to explore. I recommend a ''multi-modal'' therapy -- meaning therapy that addresses parenting and parent-teen relationships; psychopharmacology; and also some form of group treatment or 12-step program (for example Stealers Anonymous). Debra

Good kid (15) who steals compulsively

I am co-parenting my little sister-in-law (age 15). She had a pretty rough childhood with a lot of losses. Anyway, although she's a great kid, she has always stolen, and then lied about it. When her mother started getting sick, and didn't seem to be able to help or even deal with her, she came to live with us. Since she's been with us, she's made major improvements, academically, socially, etc. I think the trick was getting an accurate diagnosis of a learning disability, which helped us all understand her better. Once she started having some success in her life, and feeling better about herself, most of the negative behavior went away. In fact, she's usually very trustworthy, and a hard worker.

However, it pains me to say that we just found out she is still stealing. She stole some money from us (I don't think she has yet graduated to shoplifting, but I wouldn't put it past her to steal from anyone else (i.e., a guest) in the house, if the opportunity arose). We feel so betrayed, sad, hurt and angry, but my strongest feeling is fear and concern for her future. Although I love my in-laws, I wish she had come to live with us at a younger age; we are dealing now with her first 12 years of punitive, shaming discipline and corporal punishment, coupled with inconsistency, lack of structure and not a lot of demonstrations of affection.

I can't even begin to describe the different ways we've tried to approach this. She was in therapy ("talk" therapy) for a year, the first year she lived with us, but that is all. So one thing I am asking for advice on is what TYPE of therapy might be good for helping her with this issue, which seems like a compulsion. It's clear that it's not about the money, that there are underlying emotional issues that she needs help dealing with. She's a little distant emotionally, and doesn't like to express sadness or anger. She also doesn't like to be touched, hugged, anything. I don't think it's like full-blown attachment disorder, but I do think she has some real issues in that department, probably stemming from a traumatic birth and early infancy and compounded by the way she was raised. Anyway, I'M not the therapist here: I can't figure out how to help her, and I feel so desperate! So, again, if anyone has ideas about what type of therapy might help her develop some self-control, get at the underlying issues, etc., it would be very helpful. I suspect she needs something other than "talk therapy" to get past her (well-developed) defenses.

My second request for advice is if anyone knows any particular therapists and/or groups that they think might be good. We have Kaiser, so anyone at any Kaiser in the bay area would be great (we'll go anywhere!). However, our primary concern is to get her skilled help, so we are willing to pay out of pocket for a private therapist. Moreover, I think it's really important to find someone who is culturally competent, especially with urban teens and families, and women of color. She's not a "defiant" kid, or really "hard," and she doesn't have ADD, so those types of groups would be inappropriate.

My third request for advice is simply for ANYTHING folks can think of that might be helpful! Like I said earlier, it's too much to try to describe everything we've done in the past and everything we are doing now, but I will say that we are VERY STRUCTURED. Rather, we have been fairly structured, and then have given her more independence and trust when she seems to be proving trustworthy, and now feel the need to "clamp down" on her again. So, any commiseration and recommendations would be much appreciated!

Sincerely,
Desperate "quasi-parent"

Although my daughter has been in therapy for many years, recently she has initiated a change to a less frequent and more intense therapy. It is helping her steady her life in general but I am not sure it is addressing underlying issues per se. Seems sometimes kids can't do that - they need help coping with the present. My experience is that letting the consequences fall hard for the destructive behaviors -- no rescuing ! -- helps (even somewhat dispassionately -- in our case I tried to respond with minimal drama -- she had to pay reparations to the store, go to youth court, will have to do community service, has to go with me to the drug ed class and submit to random testing -- i.e. consequence that are imposed not just by me but that have institutional support from the outside - youth court, etc -- its is a response from the real world, not just a parent thing). This helps, while at the same time continuing to be loving, structured, and trying hard not to take the episodes of this kind of behavior personally or emotionally -- all this does help.

A very hard thing is to fully accept the complexity of the situation -- which you seem to have already done -- that the kid IS wonderful, one does love them and they love back and STILL can act in ways one finds outrageous (and which can indeed be dangerous to them) because of their past wounds. I have been told that stealing is not at all uncommon for older adoption kids and they often take from the people they love. Youth court does have a "stealing education class" -- I don't know much more about it but it was mentioned at our preliminary youth court hearing. I can try to get more information about it when we go back for the formal hearing later this week and post the info for you here. But if it is anything like the drug ed class we have been doing it might be helpful -- the drug awareness class is very helpful - even if one already "knows" the information -- the experience of going over it with other people ( other adolescents and their families) can be very moving and productive. Finally, seek support from other parents dealing with kids who have had these tough early experiences - because it is just different, in some ways, from normal parenting. I hope some of this might be helpful -- good luck and courage.

I am the single parent of a young teen. In the last six months or so, my daughter has noticed that a friend of hers "happens" to have a lot of identical clothing and other personal items, concurrent with my daughter noticing the items absent. None of these items is expensive (makeup, clothing, stickers), and when my daughter mentions to the girl how "odd" it is that she has the same things, the girl is not defensive at all in explaining how she came to have the same things. But the items are uncommon enough that it is very unlikely that she could have gotten the exact same things. She even went so far as to tell a mutual friend that my daughter gives her the makeup my daughter doesn't want. Outside of the obvious problem, the girl's mother is a friend and we carpool, etc. and I don't want to offend the family by bringing this to their attention. Anybody have any suggestions?

I'd start off my saying: "I have something to say to you that its difficult for me to talk to you about but I think you should know - its about your daughter - I'm telling you this because I care.. Then just say what you said in the posting - too many coincidences and in fact admissions.

On another note: why does your daughter still hang out with a "friend" who's stealing from her? Doesn't sound like much of a friend and I think your daughter should stand up for herself and NOT be friends (or at least seriously evaluate the friendship) with someone who has betrayed her trust and who is being a thief and a liar - at best the "friend" is using her (sounds harsh but its true). If the "friend" has "issues" (self esteem, wants material things that her family can't afford, etc.) then her family needs to deal with it and your daughter needs to think about the friendship. Is the friend doing other things like shoplifting? What if your daughter was with her at the time? Karen

Once Oliver's problems became obvious, I sharply restricted what they could do together and never allowed Oliver in the house when I was away - I still don't. In middle school I would not allow my son to go with Oliver to the nearby shops, though he was allowed to go with other friends, because Oliver had been caught shoplifting at the local toy store and I didn't want my son to be there when he did it the next time. My son didn't like this, but I think he understood my position. I have spoken with the parents many times over the years. It is not very effective to talk to the parents in this case. They are well aware of the problems their kid has, have tried various strategies over the years (therapy, meds, changing schools, even moving). They have heard it so often, they are somewhat defensive, maybe in an effort to protect their troubled kid. Also their approach to parenting is to require their kids to always take responsibility no matter what, even in cases where the parent ought to be taking responsibility, and the penalties they impose are quite harsh in my opinion. For example, they once called off a special Iceland birthday party the morning of, disappointing all the invitees, because Oliver broke a minor family rule. (The 10-year-old Oliver was required to phone all the kids - we parents were not informed.) Or cancelling Halloween trick-or-treating at the last minute because Oliver called his sister a name. So I only phone them in extreme cases (i.e., police coming to my house to ask about Oliver's next-door-neighbor's broken window - my son was there when it happened so Oliver told the police to talk to him.)

When it became clear that toys (and even money) had disappeared from our house during the time Oliver was there, I did not call his parents, but I did confront him. This was when he was in his early teens. He denied it very vigorously. I told him that I like him, and I want him to stay friends with my son, but we can't have things taken from the house and I will have to do whatever it takes to prevent that from happening. I also had a talk with my son. He defended his friend and was upset that I might stop them from seeing each other, but he also acknowledged that his friend was stealing and had always had this stealing problem. Initially this seemed to work, Oliver seemed to appreciate that I was dealing directly with him, and things of ours stopped disappearing. But then another friend had some very special collectables taken when my son and Oliver were visiting his house. This other kid wasn't friends with Oliver - my son took Oliver over there, so I felt somewhat responsible. When the collectables turned up later at Oliver's house, my son told me. I phoned Oliver and very earnestly tried to convince him to return them. He denied he had taken them. So I phoned the other friend's mother. She had to go to Oliver's house to collect them, had to insist to be taken to Oliver's bedroom to prove to Oliver's parents that he had taken them.

So I guess my advice is to do what you can to protect your things, and make sure your own child understands what the problem is and takes similar protective steps. Calling the parents might not work if they have been receiving reports from years from lots of other people.

Daughter, 12, won't stop stealing

I just found out that my middle daughter (sixth grade) who will be tweleve next month has been stealing money from my purse. I am so upset. She has been stealing since she was in second grade. She stole a CD from her dance teacher, she has stolen pencil boxes from her class mates. She takes things from her sisters (ages 13 and 8). She steals candy in the house etc. So far I have made her write pages and pages of lines saying she knows it is wrong to steal, she won't steal again etc. I have taken away activities she likes to do etc. I thought I was handling the problem properly. Now I am devastated. I don't know what to do. I cleaned out her room and took away all her things, except her clothes. I found her diary and read it. She seems to be completely normal, her diary did not reveal she is having any problems at all. She is a honor role student who had math anxiety a couple of years ago. I spent a huge amount of money getting her tutored, and now she gets A's in math. I am aware of the middle child syndrome and always make sure she does not feel insecure. She is a little overweight, whereas her sister are not. When I ask what makes her steal, she says she does not know. What can I do? Anon