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Berkeley Parents Network > Advice > Teens, Preteens, & Young Adults > Poor Performance in High School
Our 15 year old is marginal student at a Catholic high school the cost of which is currently a financial burden exacerbated by both parents being unemployed. Despite that, we are willing to continue sacrificing if she only tries a different approach to her studies (i.e. not leaving everything to the last minute)to get a better outcome. She's refused to cooperate. Should we let her call our bluff and take her out of that school? I'm afraid if that happens, what will have been achieved ultimately? We won the war but lost the battle. Furthermore, the public school she would be assigned is very undesirable. What's the solution? The decision must be made by June 15!
If you are both not working it might give you time to spend with your daughter, and she can participate in setting her own goals within structures. There is a lot of info on the Parents' Network website to start. Networking with other homeschooling parents might also help you expand your horizons. Homeschoolers can be fairly enterprising people.
Even if you don't make the move ultimately - actively exploring the options might help your daughter take some ownership of her education. Right now you are combining a lot of stress with finances, habits, adolescence and maybe the school itself - possibly unavoidable considering the public education options and the economy - but somehow you need to get thru this at a critical time in her development.
The parochial setting is not for everyone. Probably though you need to get this thought thru so you don't get stuck with next year's tuition if you do decide to move out of the spot. Depending on the school and her year, it might be hard to get back in. If her grades are suffering and she can't pull it off, there are more reasons to be making this ''option review'' than the money. If she likes the school and wants to stay there, then see if they have study skill counseling - most private schools do, and they can help her with the time management skills. Stressing her probably won't. You need to be honest though if you can really afford it.
Do not envy your difficulties but sincerely hoping something does turn up. Sometimes asking the right questions makes all the difference in the answers. Encouraging Conversation
1st, and right away after an incomplete assignment, take away the cell phone, tv, and computer for the night/weekend.
2nd, if 1st doesn't work, cancel all friend/social time, non-school activities that aren't necessary (I think sports, leadership, community services are necessary)until the appropriate effort is demonstrated such as homework complete, test studied for, etc...
3rd, if above doesn't make an impression all fancy products & clothing beyond the minimum of hygiene, and adequate clothing, so out go make-up, hair gel, hair spray, body spray, designer/label shoes, purses, skinny jeans, etc...
The above are all privileges, NOT entitlements. When a child, or adult for that matter, isn't pulling their load, they don't enjoy the fruits of hard work, and success.
There is no magic, or mystery to this, just CONSISTENCY, CONSISTENCY, CONSISTENCY.
Good luck, and be strong! Beryle
I looked in the archives under 'dropping out', unmotivated, etc., but mostly found stories of students leaving high school to take classes at a jc, etc. These don't quite fit our situation, so I thought I'd post our story.
Daughter is 15 - a sophomore. She has received poor grades since 8th grade, failing most of her classes. She has had educational testing and has been found to have no special needs, aside from moderate ADD. In my non-trained but parent focused eye, she seems to give up whenever faced with a challenge - she gets behind, or skips an assignment, or anything, and then can't get motivated to try to catch up, thus falling farther behind, until she gives up completely.
She is too young for the CHSPE, and hasn't finished sophomore year; doesn't seem interested in classes at a JC or anywhere; too young to work, but not passing high school. She says she likes her current school, but I suspect it's the social life she likes. When in a particularly open mood, she admits to being sad or depressed about everything.
My own theory - she has gotten herself into a corner that she can't get out of. Too stubborn, too far behind, too unmotivated, or something. And she doesn't want to talk about it at all and becomes completely closed off every time the subject of school is broached. not sure where to turn or how to help her.
not giving up
Id like to recommend a book called ''EMPOWERING UNDERACHIEVERS'' by Peter A. Spevak, phD. The book is not the answer to the situation but it gave my husband and I some ideas what might have been going on with our son and from there, we somehow were able to struggle out of the situation. It's not an over night fix and he isn't totally out of woods yet but doing better and will be graduation next spring.
As a fellow parent, if anything I can do to help you, please do not hesitate to contact me...I can feel your pain, and I understand how powerless you might feel. Nobuko
My son is a sophmore taking Math IIIA. He is very bright, and understands the math very well- all agree on this. Yet, he makes ''stupid errors'' on exams, etc. This has become a big problem, and this year his grade is seriously affected. We have seen very good tutors, but all seem baffled, and have little to offer, as he so clearly understand s the math. I feel that we need some type of math specialist or educational psychologist to help. it is so hard to see him fail, when he so clearly understands the concepts. We hjave already visited several of the highly recommended tutors on this site. Any ideas? looking for ideas
How does he do on his math homework? Does he get perfect scores on his homework? If so, is it because he checks and rechecks his work to eliminate careless errors?
My experience with my daughter when she was in high school sounds a bit similar. She understood the concepts, but really was not interested in taking the time and making the effort to neatly write out all of her work so that she could easily double check her work. She would write tiny, partly erase equations and write over them, etc. In other words, the mechanics of going step by step to get the answer didn't interest her, only the general concept. Once she got the big picture, the mechanics were boring.
What helped my daughter was doing practice problems before a test. I'd go over them with her and point out careless errors so she could get a better feel for on what kinds of problems she was more likely to make mistakes. I extolled the virtue of writing neatly and writing out most steps in solving a problem. This was difficult for her as she wanted to rush ahead and get the answer, but sometimes the error she made was in the mental arithmetic in the step that she thought was too trivial to write down. That made it impossible to spot the arithmetic error when she was hurrying to double check her work at the end of a test.
I think your strategy is going to depend on the nature of the errors he makes on his tests and whether he has test anxiety. At a minimum, you might suggest that he try writing out all steps in solving a problem and also doing practice problems before test day. Janet
The unrecognized problem turned out to be drum roll please mild dyslexia. I would read 58 as 85, or 1478 as 1487, etc. Or my brain would be moving much faster than my pencil, and the number that my brain was on would accidentally be written down.
It's common for mild dyslexia to be missed in very bright people. been there
I have a son who just is not interested in school. He is almost 17. He does not do drugs or drink and so that is not a problem...he just does not find school interesting and so he does not do well. He is in therapy and was tested negative for ADD/ADHD but also tested quite bright academically. I would like some advice from any other parents who have had this issue. Did you find a high school that worked for your son/daughter? Did your child take the High School exit exam and just forget the whole thing and move on? He does not need a therapeutic high school as he is not a behavior problem. I do not want to push him into another, fruitless, year(s) of high school where all it does is destroy any self-esteem he has left. Any ideas would be highly appreciated. looking for advice
My 16 y.o. step-daughter is failing high school. Last year when she got an F in a class, her father stepped in and tried to get counseling, tutoring and any kind of help he could from 40 miles away. Her mother has never offered her any help or explanation as to why she didn't say or do anything before this. (She and my husband don't have a custody agreement and my step-daughter spends time with us when she ''feels like it'' which these days is not often). This seemed to backfire in my husbands face...his daughter refused to talk to him, answer his calls, etc. for months. This devastated him and he felt he could do nothing right. Now things are on better terms between the two of them, (and us as well as she was mad at me too, of course...) but we just got her report card and she has 4 F's, a C-, and an Incomplete. She's a junior in high school. We are devastated. My husband is afraid to step in again for fear of the wrath of her mother and because his relationship with his daughter is finally on the mend. I've been in my step-daughter's life since she was 17 m.o. She is my daughter too. But alas, I am just the step-mom and have been told by many that it's not place to say or do anything. Meanwhile my heart is breaking that she is having this trouble and neither one of her parents is doing anything about it. I understand why my husband feels the way he does (and remember there's 16 years of history here and consequently many other reasons why he feels the way that he does) but I don't necessarily agree with how he is handling the situation. How do I support him through this? How do I get her the help she needs without seeming to interfere? between a rock and a hard place
My 14 year old son is a very bright 8th grader with ADD, and possibly some other issues (OCD? Depression? Video game addiction?) His grades started out as B's in 6th grade, and have progressively gotten worse, to C's, D's and F's. He has also had more behavior problems this year, and after being sent to the office one too many times, won't be able to participate in any of the graduation parties or end of the year activities at school.
No amount of threats or rewards have helped with the grades or the behavior. Mostly it seems like he really, truly, doesn't care. We go back and forth between leaning over his shoulder and inspecting every last homework assignment (which causes lots of fights and stress around the house, and only works a little bit on the grades) and letting him manage his homework himself (which he doesn't do). The middle ground doesn't work because he'll tell us he's done his homework when he really hasn't.
He's a nice kid--people like him--he has a sense of humor, and when he's not stressed, he's fun to be around. We're not having big behavior problems at home--just the normal teenager stuff. When school's out, we get along great.
I have many questions I hope some of you might be able to help with.
1. Has anyone ever heard of taking a year off between 8th
grade and high school to do something else that would
allow him to mature more, be more prepared for high
school? I can't imagine what this would be, but some sort
of alternative educational situation? I can't home school
and can't afford private school.
2. Is there a good mental health practitioner out there who could diagnose and treat both his ADD (he's been diagnosed for this already) as well as other possible problems like depression? I don't think drugs and alcohol are involved at this point, though it wouldn't surprise me if at some point they are, so I'd like someone familiar with addiction too (I seriously do think he has a video game addiction). I've gotten referrals from my health ins. co., but I've never found anyone on their lists who's actually available, and if they are, no one I know has ever heard of them.
3. Are there any good parenting support groups out there that don't cost anything?
4. Have you tried anything that worked to motivate your teen?
Thanks albany parent
More than anything else, your son may need to have you and other people understand what school is like for him. Then hell need a specific plan for school success. You might want to read Mel Levines One Mind at a Time, and also the biographies of Jonathan Mooney and David Cole, two young people with ADHD and dyslexia, in their successful book, Learning Outside the Lines. Then go on to Russell Barkleys Taking Charge of ADHD, which is a guide for parents. Caroline
Then we read ''bright minds, poor grades'' and it helped us a great deal. It takes a no-stress approach that puts the responsibility in the kid's court. I really liked the approach and it worked. It takes a lot of HARD work and COMMITMENT but I can tell you - it works. My son is now 16 and doing all his work on his own and getting A's and B's with a C here or there.
The other thing we did was use our ''D is for disappear'' program. If he received a D in a class, or was missing an assignment - things would disappear - 2 times it was severe (from a progress report grade, or if we got a phone call) where he only had 2 outfits, one pair of shoes and everything else disappeared for one week or two. This will motivate a teen! sure it's harsh - but our point was - why should you get things when you aren't doing your ''work.'' How will your child survive as an adult if they get everything they need/want without working for it? He got the message that we were serious and his ''job'' was to get good grades, turn in assignments on time etc. All of this was done with very minimal lecturing and anger from the parents - just ''we said this would be the consequence and your actions triggered it'' We made a list of things that would disappear if we found out about missing assignments, bad grades etc. The teachers sent us a weekly or bimonthly report on whether there were issues in their class - including behavior - like talking too much etc. Check if your school will do this, most do. So at times, the cell phone was gone (devastating to our son) or other more minor disappearances...all discussed ahead of time - posted on his wall so he had no excuse when something came about.
The maturation process for some boys is very slow and very frustrating. Once you get over that - and stick to your plan, you will see progress. Also, as often as possible find ways to encourage and acknowledge where they have made progress (something the book also discusses). Sometimes i'd be annoyed or frustrated with the amount of work it all took on my part - but it was definitely worth it and he is growing up in front of our eyes! it happens - don't give up on them and roll up your sleeves.
Also try ''anger'' by thich naht hanh - good for the parents...on how to cultivate compassion for your son and others in your life. find motivation for your kids!
Yes, there is an addiction to video games -- addiction is when your brain changes in response to playing them -- Berman is great at explaining that.
My son responds to humor and to people who ''get'' his humor - - with Berman that's check and double check!
Unfortunately motivation comes with maturation. But along the way get support! I have seen support groups posted on the wall of the doctor's office.
My son is 16 1/2 -- I'm just a small stretch up the road. Honestly, it doesn't get easier for awhile. You sound very level headed and realistic. I'm sending you cyber support! a mom on the same road
My very bright 16 year old grandson has begun to dislike
school. He is getting passing grades when he was usually
an AB student. This began a year ago. His attitude is
that school grades do not matter to him. He was very
active in sports but this year he quit basketball at
school, to concentrate on volleyball. He's been playing
basketball on leagues since he was 6 years old. His
parents are perplexed and very upset. There have been many
arguments with him and he has left home. He thankfully
calls me and I go pick him up. I don't know what to do.
This is his junior year in high school. He's a good kid,
well liked by his peers. He is the oldest in the family
and has a younger sister who is also a basketball player
and an A student. Any advice would be welcomed
We provide individual WASC accredited high school courses, and use a one-to-one approach (one teacher for one student) for students who need courses for various reasons. Our courses are UC approved. We use a mastery learning approach so your grandson would be sure to experience success in his classes at our school. If he does not do well on a test, we re-teach and re-test to be sure that he succeeds. Our hourly fees are the same as most tutoring programs in the area and the average semester course is completed in approximately 30 hours. Please call School For Independent Learners, East Bay Branch at 510-835-5505 if you would like more information. Karen
He could be feeling pressure from his parents to be a certain way (good student, good basketball player, etc.) and in response to the pressure and expectation he is moving in a different direction. Maybe he is afraid to fail or let them down so he doesn't want to try (one of my current clients in this situation). I am curious what it is about your relationship that is different from his parents that makes him feel comfortable calling you? That may be a place to look for some insights into what is going on.
Or he could be feeling pressure from his peers to be a
certain way that is different from the way he has been.
There is a tremendous amount of pressure to ''be cool'' that
can cause teens to act out of alignment with who they
really are and what they value. Being cool can sometimes
become more important than anthing else. Something is
definitely out of balance and I am sure that he is having a
hard time as well as his parents.
Hello, I need a recommendation for an alternative way of learning preferably a school that a 15 year old boy, who has been tested in the Contra Costa school system, and has been slated for remedial classes. He has a hard time concentrating, writing skills are poor, and very forgetful plus low self esteem. If someone can please recommend something in the Bay Area that would be helpful. Thank you in advance.
What do you do with a 15 year-old freshman who has been described by a teacher as "sometimes almost brilliant" who just brought home 3 C's on his report card? With the note "work turned in late/incomplete."
A. drag him to a psychologist to discuss his feelings about his father's
mental illness and disappearance
B. punish him (how?)
C. set up a reward (bribe)
D. make him go to summer school, missing the family vacation, if his final grade is a C (this would go against other family values)
E. other ______________
F. all of the above
His only input is that the teachers involved don't like him/he doesn't like them/or the work is boring.
Thanks in advance for all your suggestions. I'm not feeling confident in my "parenting of a teenager" abilities.
1. punishments - I've tried all these for periods of a week to an entire grading period: come straight home after school, no TV, no video/computer games, no weekend sleepovers, no more allowance Result: no noticable results
2. rewards - instead of allowance, hefty bonus for A's and B's, nothing for C's, deductions for D's and F's. Extra bonus of TV in his room for all As and Bs. Result: slight improvement first grading period but zero profits all grading periods since then and he never qualified for the TV
3. nagging & lectures - "Where do you want to be in 2 years?" "How will you live in the Bay Area on miniumum wage?" "How will you get into college with a 2.3 GPA?" "When I was in High School" "All the Things you Have that I Didn't Have" etc. etc. etc. Even his friends nag him about his crummy grades. Result: if he's feeling happy, he says either "I guess I'm just lazy" or "Mom - think of what you're doing to my self-esteem" If his self-esteem is low, or I push him too hard, he says: "You just want me to be perfect! I'm not like you were!" and there is a big screaming fight and we both feel terrible for days .... I know self-esteem does come into this, but how do you preserve their self-esteem while still trying to prevent them from making huge mistakes?
4. private school - my son takes this as a threat. Very possibly this might have helped, but he loves the social life at BHS so much, and it is so important to him to be with the friends he's known since kindergarten, that I have never seriously considered this.
5. tutoring - this is about the same as trying to get him to do regular school work, only there is an additional person also trying, and you have to pay them to do it. The problem is not that he doesn't understand the material - he doesn't want to do it. The tutor also wasn't able to convince him to do it.
6. phoning/meeting with teachers - Result: predictable ("He doesn't turn in the work") This can also have the undesired effect of turning the teacher's attention to a previously unnoticed poor student, which has a couple of times for us meant even WORSE grades - now the teacher is expecting lousy performance from your kid so even if he improves, he may be already tagged for failure. On the other hand, I think it's good to meet with the teacher now and then so your kid knows you are interested, and that you care about his school work and are trying to find a way to make things better.
7. meeting with the school counselor - This was beneficial. The counselor listed all the classes and credits he's taken and he is actually not doing as badly as we thought, even though his grades suck, as he puts it. She had some helpful suggestions (find a study group). We felt encouraged. She also suggested we NOT take him off his jr. varsity team, something we had considered, because outside activities help with college applications. I also realized that being on the team is a big part of his identity, and that it helps him feel important and useful, so it would be devastating to have that taken away even if it interferes with his academic performance, which I am not so sure about.
8. talking with my friends - this helps a lot. Everyone has stories of the sister/nephew/husband/son who went thru high school with a C average and then blossomed in college when he found his niche. Or even later than college. Or maybe never, but "he's a really nice guy and everyone loves him." Seriously, some of my friends have teenagers who are brilliant in school, same schools as my kids all the way through, have fabulous GPA's and all sorts of extra-curricular activities, and are highly self-motivated, seemingly right out of the womb. That does get discouraging and it's hard to acknowledge that my kid just isn't like that. But it still helps to talk to other parents, because there are all sorts of kids, some better off than yours but some worse off too.
9. focusing on his good points - He's a personable guy, enjoyable to be around, has a good bunch of friends. These attributes can sometimes be more useful in life than stellar grades. And we have a pretty good relationship and he has never given me any problems with bad or risky behavior, which I am grateful for. I hardly ever tell him I appreciate these qualities, and I should do it more, now that I think about it - it seems like they can't get enough praise. He doesn't say anything back, but if I just say "You look nice in that shirt" his face lights up!
Anyway, I hope you don't put too much blame on yourself, because there are a lot of us out here struggling with the exact same problem, and there don't seem to be any easy solutions, at least not that I've found. But I'm always open to new ideas, so if anyone has something, send it on!
In your multiple choice test use psychology, punishment and witholding sparingly; I have had the best results with bribes and threats. If you use bribes, give the reward and then threaten to withdraw it if the desired behavior doesn't materialize. For example, put the phone in the bedroom, but clearly state that if there's more than one C (or whatever standard you want to hold him to) that the phone will be removed. It's a "you catch more flys with honey than vinegar" thing.
Most importantly, (at least to me) don't sacrifice other family values unless absolutely necessary. Seek out some large privelege or material thing he wants, and either tie it to the report card or give it and say it will be taken away if the standard isn't met.
Above all, be consistent and follow through. Do what you say you'll do. If you make a threat and fail to follow through, all you've done is teach him that your threats are meaningless.
This approach works for me and my daughter, I hope it works for you!
It might be worth screening him for a brain disorder/mental illness. You mention that his father has a mental illness, and sometimes those are hereditary. I don't know what his dad has, but if a teen is struggling with bipolar disorder, depression, or ADD, their life can get pretty out of control. Treating the underlying illness might help him get back on track.
The only thing that is more challenging than parenting a teenager is parenting a teenager with a mental illness, but it can be done. Finding out if there is anything going on with the brain chemistry can really help. Best wishes to you.
I would like to request advice. My 16-year old daughter is a sophomore at Albany High. Though all her teachers consider her quite bright, she seems to have enormous difficulty with homework, which is absolutely required at Albany, and with personal organization in general -- she cuts a lot of class. She is also extremely stubborn and inclined to be a free spirit -- she is pretty regularly a behavior problem in class. Her gradepoint average is currently zero-point-something. She is now considering transferring to MacGregor High, where she thinks she can get back on track and hopefully return to Albany to graduate her senior year. Transferring to another district is not really an option for us and private sckool is out of the question (besides, with her GPA, who'd have her?). She has been tested by a Berkeley learning specialist, Andora Freeman, who said there was no reason she shouldn't be getting at least B's. She did get straight B's her first quarter at Albany High, but something happened the second quarter and it was all down hill from there. I have been told that MacGregor considers itself an "alternative" skool and is not necessarily a "dumping ground" for troubled kids. Does anyone know any MacGregor success stories? Horror stories? Are there other public alternative schools/programs in the Albany/Berkeley area that we might consider??? My daughter is also in therapy and her therapist is flummoxed as to how to motivate her to succeed in school.
I wonder if sometimes there isn't a mother-daughter issue sort of built in to this period of life, something that fathers never experience with daughters.
And I wonder, too, how parents avoid the trap of being constantly picking on the negative stuff when there seems so much negative, and instead find ways to glow about the positive stuff, to have faith that everything we've done in the previous years of life is enough, and that this individual that we have nurtured up to now is ready to be on his/her own more, how we find a different way to parent from how we did it when our child was 10 or 12. It seems to me that just when I've figured out how this works, we have moved on to something different and I'm having to learn all over again. I wonder sometimes how I can be so thick.
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