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Anger, Hostility & Defiance in Teens

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16-y-o daughter is easily agitated, has explosive temper

August 2009

My daughter is easily agitated, and has a very explosive temper. She is desperate to prove she is ''an adult'' (will turn 17 next month), and often feels like she is not getting the respect and autonomy that she ''deserves.'' Then she gets so mad that she slams doors, yells obscenities, and sometimes just storms out of the house. I don't really expect her to be able to ''get it'' that at almost 17 she is NOT AT ALL an adult, but I would like her to at least learn some better ways of coping with her anger. The door slamming and obscenities are annoying and dis-respectful, but maybe i could learn to live with; my main concern is leaving the house at night, which feels really dangerous. Recently she was backpacking with her dad, and got so mad she stomped off into the woods by herself, which feels REALLY dangerous. I'd just like her to find a way to express her anger that also encompasses keeping herself safe. Is this an unrealistic expectation for her age?!?

We have worked with two different therapists, I liked them both, but she thinks therapy is ''stupid,'' ''boring'' and ''doesn't work.'' Our last session, she explained to the therapist that she wouldn't have to get so mad if other people just would stop being so annoying; in other words, it's not HER fault, it's OURS.

I thought maybe a class or a peer group might be a better fit for her. Any ideas? She is hoping to get her driver's license soon, and I don't want her driving on her own until she gets a better handle on her anger management! Mom concerned with explosive anger


You asked if you can expect your 17 year old daughter to be able to control her anger. The answer is a firm, yes! So, no, you should not have to tolerate yelling at you in your home or the slamming of doors. You can expect to have a basic, house rule: All members of the household treat other members with respect.

I have two daughters, one 22 and one almost 17. My oldest was very explosive. I learned some parenting techniques that really helped. One, do not stick around if your teen is speaking to you in a disrespectful way. I have my mantra statement, ''I respect myself too much to allow anyone to speak to me in an abusive way''. I state the above and then turn around and leave, immediately. I go to my bedroom and if my teen follows, I take my keys and leave for 15 to 20 minutes. Do not stand there and be yelled at and do not engage an angry teen in the moment. Come back to issues when all parties are no longer upset. Take control of your house again. My oldest used to slam doors too. After a warning, I removed the door to her room for a week. That made an impression and put an end to slammed doors. You must give your teen the idea that you will not tolerate her explosive behavior. For one, it could really put her at risk, with the wrong person and/or with the law. Then too, is this how you want your teen to act in other relationships and is this the model you want to give your daughter for how adult women are treated?

My oldest also refused therapy, until I made a statement that I meant. Go to therapy if you wish to remain in this house. She knew by my tone that I meant business. I recommend Terry Trotter, in Albany, marvelous with teens. Just think, would you allow your 17 year old to not seek cancer treatment? Then why do so now? Be firm, quiet and non-negotiable about consequences, and fair. I would also explore any mental health reasons why your daughter is so explosive. My youngest was put on a particular medication that caused a side effect of raging. Once the med was discontinued, the rages stopped.

As for leaving the house at night without permission, call the police. In form your daughter that this is what you will do if she is missing late at night; you will call the police 1st and ask questions later. They really can be very good with teens. By the way, my relationship with both of my daughters improved dramatically once I set firm limits and meant them. Good luck anon


My son (14) also has explosive episodes and thought you might find it helpful to check out the evidence-based Collaborative Problem Solving method developed by Dr. Ross Greene at Harvard and Dr. Stuart Ablon at Massachusetts General and described in their co-authored books The Explosive Child and Treating Explosive Kids, and described further on Dr. Ablon's website ThinkKids.org. Until my husband and I learned about this method we were at a complete loss with how to deal with the explosions and what happened to our family in the aftermath of them. I attended a training in the method lead by Dr. Ablon last month in Boston, and my husband and I are both studying the Treating Explosive Kids book and I can tell you that since we have started using CPS, the explosive episodes have nearly stopped. I don't mean they don't come up....they still do, but we as a family now have an very effective method for predicting them, dealing with them in the moment, and addressing the triggers that preclude them so that our son is learning (with our help) how to develop the cognitive skills needed for emotional regulation. Although the method is becoming well-known in the East Coast and many local clinicians have heard of the book(s) we could find only one clinician in Northern California who had been through the CPS training (and she was not currently using it in her practice). But, the book is very, very helpful, and if you are interested Dr. Ablon will be doing a parent training in Los Angeles at Asusa Pacific University in early October. We have found hope. Been there
Our daughter was also displaying lots of anger, and oppositional behavior and was adamantly opposed to going to therapy too but we gave her no choice and went as a family. It's been about eight months and we've seen a lot of improvement especially in the last couple of months since we enlisted a new system to help us all change what wasn't working for us. I found some information on the internet and we all had a hand in developing a plan to fit our family goals. She wanted more ''freedom,'' and we wanted to see her take more responsibility so we could trust that she was ready for more freedom. I was never one to stick to a behavior modification plan before but I figure I'm not doing anyone any favors by avoiding what we should have had in place years ago. This system is to help reinforce our daughter's self-discipline, which includes my letting go of wanting to ''help'' her by keeping her room organized, etc., and last but not least we really needed to improve our communication. On our list: responsibility toward the household, more self-reliance in money management, speaking to us respectfully, and healthy lifestyle habits like exercise. This is the framework only. Each one of those points is laid out in great detail. If she hits all the expectations we've laid out together she gets a set amount of daily allowance and a nice bonus at the end of the week if she manages a solid week. She's in charge of her own expenses except for school related expenses, health expenses, food, and things she needs for the household like a new lamp or chair, for instance. If she wants to earn extra money she can do more chores. If she wants to save for something special her allowance is increased until she meets her goal. It's been about six weeks and we had some really rough patches at first. She's learning the things I should have been teaching her all along and she's gaining self-esteem from living more responsibly and more peacefully. One thing that really helped her realize this system wasn't going to just go away if she pretended it wasn't there was that her privileges were revoked until she participated: no visiting friends, no driving privileges and no computer. I consider this approach a success but also a work in progress. This may not be what you are looking for but I highly encourage you to get your family some professional therapy to work out your communication issues. Working on It
How about no driver's license until some anger control is shown? What happens when your child decides to ''exhibit anger'' on the road, or at school? Maybe you could attend one of Mike Riera's sessions on parenting teens. Anon
dear mom, it seems really scary to know your daughter might be unsafe when she gets taken over by anger. Reading your question brought these thoughts to me and let me share with you. You and your daughter might benefit from mediation led by someone from the NVC community (Marshall Rosenberg developed NVC which is basically a language of compassion). i have been a single mom and got help with my family (daughter, partner) and NVC empathy & mediation have been very fruitful for us (e.g. at some point, my daughter wanted to die). i strongly recommend Grace Maina (from Empathy and Grace) who helped us. She is very sensitive, smart, efficient. she is able to lead us safely to the core of situations with compassion and care, making it possible to see each other humanity. you can contact Grace at 510 776-0920 (website: www.empathyandgrace.com e-mail: grace@empathyandgrace.com) compassionate mother
I think all parents struggle with teaching kids self-control, but since your daughter wants a driver's license and driving privileges, you have a tremendous carrot you can use now for behavioral modification. You could set up a calendar with a gold star for each day she controls her temper at home. Seven gold stars equals one daytime occasion of driving? It's corny (and would have worked better when she was a lot younger). There are other privileges that should be contingent on being a ''good roommate'' who does her chores and homework and has civil manners-- allowance, cell phone, overnights, nights out, rides, desired activities?

Remember, until she's 18 (or has had a driver's license one year) she has to drive with an adult in the shotgun seat. You should be prepared to order her to pull over and give you the keys, if she misbehaves. If she won't obey such an order, why give her the car keys in the first place?

My mom taped a sign to the dashboard when we were teens: ''You are driving a lethal weapon.'' It was quite sobering.

Sorry, I don't know of anger management groups, although it sounds like family counseling might be a good idea too-- you must be very frustrated, and a therapist can help you learn how to talk things out with each other.

The ''dashing outside'' stuff sounds more dangerous. Either go after her and haul her back, or call the cops, or get her to a police league self-defense class for girls.

I have a 15 yr old girl who is sometimes emotional and disrespectful. Most of the time it's not about me, so I find it useful to respond mildly with, ''I don't deserve that tone of voice'' or ''I didn't do anything to you.'' Good luck


I have heard good things about Jodi Rabb, a therapist in Marin, who works with teens and families around anger issues. I believe she does groups.

I have used a workbook called Anger Management for Women with clients; it is written for adults, but I did have one 18 year old client who really liked using it. I also want to suggest that your daughter's behavior and frustration and irritability may be a symptom of a mood disorder, such as depression. Substance abuse or traumatic experience are also things that can be related to this type of behavior. Also, just because a teen protests about therapy doesn't mean they are not benefitting.

Best wishes to your family. Ilene


15-y-o daughter is belligerent, yells, and has meltdowns

June 2009

Any recommendations for local therapists in Lamorinda, for a 15 year old girl? She is continually in conflict with us, the parents. She is belligerent, yells everyday and has meltdowns when she's told to knock it off. She pushes all the wrong buttons, provokes, demands, screams and cries every day. Everything we say is an attack on her, she can't stand her family . She would like it if we sent her to an expensive boarding school. She feels she should have a lot of rights but frankly, with a poorly behaved child, I am unwilling to spend big $$.

. . My daughter is very ungrateful and has a real sense of entitlement. She is very smart, does pretty well at school though she puts in minimal work, has some friends. She has a high sense of entitlement. She has become, over the last 6 months even more outrageous and ''hormonal''. She has no medical problems is just a ''brat'' unfortunately. We, her family needs help, she is verbally abusive, and we are not willing to continue to be doormats. I am truly thinking, that she needs some medication on a regular basis to calm her down. I do not believe ''talking'' with her, giving rules etc. will really result in much improvement. She appears to be totally out of control... help I can not even stand to be around her. In fact, we have a ''rule'' that if she walks out of the house and goes off our property, I have told her that we will call the local police and say that she is a runaway. I have told her that she can spend a few days at the local juvenile hall. She has not walked away and I do not prod her or goad her to do it, although, frankly, it would be enlightening, I am sure for her, in a very negative way. I don't say things like- it's our house, our rules. I believe she should respect her parents and should behave in a reasonable way that is respectful to her family. I am exhausted, mentally from her bs. We are willing to participate in some sort of family therapy. I am at the end of my rope. anonymous


I can really sympathize with you; it is so hard when our kids are belligerent, are ungrateful, and so on. My son is just entering teenager-hood and already I have been brought up short by attitude, language, behavior, etc. The struggle to get the kid to conform to what seems to us normal civil behavior is frustrating. But I would say that it is important not to lose sight of the kid you love. In your letter, which was most likely written in a mood of total frustration, none of your affection for your daughter shines through. I wonder if this might also be true in the exchanges that you have -- it's hard to let love show when you're trying to out-shout each other. My recommendation to you would be to seek family therapy in which you would learn to communicate with each other in a way that is not based on mutual disrespect. I say ''mutual,'' because though you may feel that your daughter has not earned your respect, every person feels the need for it. You mention ''entitlement'' a couple of times in your letter -- I, too, have the sense that my son feels entitled to material possessions and freedoms that I wouldn't have dreamed of at his age. But I ask myself where the sense of entitlement comes from, and I have to look at how I have basically given him all of his heart's desires (within my power). He has been denied very little, so naturally he feels entitled. Perhaps that it your case as well? Your daughter very likely does not understand yet the sacrifices you have made for her, and how important it is to you that she understand and respect you. Laying down the law in harsh tones doesn't work for me. Talking and persuasion and negotiation and reiterating love and care often do. I wonder how answering shouting with a soft voice works for you? I've had my son walk out the door -- and come back a couple of hours later, and then we could talk. He doesn't have anywhere to go that would be better than home -- that's a good realization. I'm still young in the teenager business right now, so time may prove me a fool, but so far keeping an even temper, relentlessly repeating what is important to me, avoiding yelling, negotiating freedoms, etc. have worked. And I go to therapy with him (I'm a divorced mom). I think your family should definitely try the therapy route, and remember something a wise friend told me: Always tell your child you love her/him, no matter what. mother of teen
Send her to boarding school, just make it a ''boot camp'' type boarding school. She'll come back with a different view on life. No specific recommendations. sean
Dear Parents, It sounds like your daughter is out of control and needs help. Please contact Shayna Abraham at Bodin in Lafayette. Bodin works with teens with a broad spectrum of issues ranging from learning differences, attention and memory disorders, to emotional and behavioral difficulties, such as defiance at home. Bodin will not only help your daughter but you and your family as well.

I work with teens and know how difficult these years can be - you're not alone. I have referred families to Bodin and have seen tremendous progress. Bodin's website is http://www.thebodingroup.com/ I wish your daughter, you, and your family the best. Nancy


Hello, I know you were looking for a therapist for your daughter in Lamorinda; but there is a wonderful woman named Annette Walt in Walnut Creek whose specialty is teen girls. She is right off highway 24. My daughter worked with her and loved her. Best of luck to you, I know how hard it is, I went through it too, hang in there! Annie
Check your insurance and get a referral to a family therapist. There may be recommendations on the Berkeley Parents Network and you can see if any of them fall under your coverage.

There are many excellent family therapists in the Bay Area. If you have more than one choice see if you can talk to them on the phone - sometimes there is an over the phone ''in take'' brief interview. Even if everyone is totally uncomfortable, often there is a great relief of tensions after one or two visits. Having insurance coverage - even partial - can mean that you can afford longer therapy to work on family communication and dynamics.

People should not be afraid of therapy or what it may mean to see a therapist. If someone were in physical trouble you would be dialing 911, and rightfully so.

Society and families are complex, seeking help to live a great life should be the norm. I wish more people sought therapy simply to live a happier more productive life.

Good luck and best wishes -- encouraging you to make the appointment


It sounds like some of this is usual 14 yr old girl teen developmental issues that are being met by frustration, anger, and some lack of understanding. Strongly recommend that you get help for the family from experienced teen & family therapist. Try to step back from your anger and think of how she feels being met with such disappointment and anger. Maybe start weekly family meetings where everyone is listened to and had uninterrupted time to talk. Let her have some power over her life, set boundaries: she gets responsibilities taken care of then priviledges., Try to remember what you love about your daughter and find a way to hold that every day. She will not stay in this state forever but anger, guilt, resentment and blame can have lifetime ramifications. Take a meditation class, have a date weekly with your husband. Have some compassion for her and yourself. been there & doing that now
First - walk away. Go to a coffee shop, get a manicure, a makeover, have a hot tub, a spa weekend, whatever's in your budget. It will all work out.

Second - you do need to talk to your child. Each parent separately and together. It does work. A teenager seesaws emotionally between being a child and being an adult and it gives the adults around them whiplash watching them. Definitely, get a family counsellor to help you if you can. If that's not possible, take a deep breath and find a new way to communicate. A good one is to go through photographs. Kids of all ages are fascinated with photos of themselves. Maybe make copies of photos of hers that she likes, so she can have her own album. It will help remind her and you of when she was younger and you had a better relationship.

Third - listen to her. Really listen without interjecting. Really, really listen. Tell her you actually want to know what she's feeling about things, and about your relationship. You may be astonished at what's going on inside her head.

Fourth - Tell her you love her.

Fifth - talk to her friends' parents. They may know if something else is going on that's making her miserable. Also talk to your partner and get clear what unrelated pressures may be pushing you two over the edge.

Sixth - have a family meeting and set out clear rules for what each person (including yourself) contributes. Repeat the above list as necessary. Fiona


I empathize with the situation you (and the family) face with your 15 yr old daughter. My oldest was also defiant when she was the same age. In working with an enlightended, teen ''smart'' therapist, I learned a few techniques that may help you. I also have a referral for you.

One, when you have an argumentative, tantruming teen, do not try to engage her in talk in order to reason, discipline, or lecture her. The above will just fan the ''flames'' of an argument, one you will not win. When your daughter is being disrespectful, yelling etc. disengage rather than engage. I developed a phrase that became my mantra.... ''I respect myself too much to allow anyone to speak to me in an abusive way''. That said, I turned on my heels and went to my room, other part of the house, or to my car keys if need be. Important rules, health, safety, education, were enforced quietly, no lecture or discussion. All other rules (like a clean room, etc.), were simply dropped. I kept firm, quiet, and unflappable, no emotion. The above really helped. Try this with your teen. Referral: Coyote Coast in Orinda for teens, families, etc. This type of problem is their specialty.

Book: The Explosive Child by Ross Greene. Look at his technique. Talk to your teen when she is not upset and you are not upset. Try a family meeting and listen to what your teen has to say, if she says it politely. Set the ground rules beforehand and tell her you want to try to hear her when you are not fighting. Try to give some. Set a place where your daughter can go to diffuse that is hers alone. Ditto for you. My now 16 yr old, my youngest, has gotten used to mom's statement, ''I need a time out''.

The trick with teens is not to get emotional, argue, lecture, or go back to past ''crimes''. Stay matter of fact, firm and quiet. Do not engage in arguments. Try to work on your own anger, although I ''get'' why you feel angry. She still needs to feel you are on her side. Remember, it is not fun to argue with ''the fresh air'', so don't stick around if your teen is speaking to you in a disrespectful way, make your statement and leave immediately anonymous


I highly recommend counseling. I can give you the names of two women therapists who I know personally and who I trust. They are different therapists with seperate practices, one in Berkeley, and one in Oakland. Perhaps you can call and/or meet with each of them to see if one or the other might work for you. They both work with families, teens, and parents/couples. It can be very intense raising a teen and we parents need so much support; and so do our teens. I wish you the best in your search.

In Berkeley: Pamela Zelnik, MFT 510-527-0274 pamzmft@gmail.com

In Oakland: Claudia Sieber, M.A., MFT Licensed Marriage and Family Therapist 3637 Grand Ave., Suite D Oakland, CA 94610 (510) 238 0741 www.claudiasieber.com www.suddenlossgriefcounseling.com http://therapist.psychologytoday.com/47373

hildy


Daughter is withdrawn, hostile and negative

June 2007

Hello, It seems these days, my teen daughter is often withdrawn, hostile, and/or negative in her interactions with the world--within the family and toward others. Her life is basically good, so am saddened by her armor plate.

She says she wants to do things, but everything in her body language and interactions with the people around her screams she doesn't. It seems like she isn't aware of how her stance will put folks off. They try, but she doesn't often let them in. When I talk with her she doesn't want to listen. She covers her head, plugs her ears.

I'm scarred she's creating a path that will dictate her future in ways she won't be able to change. Any advise on how to talk so they will listen. Feeling helpless. Anon


This may be counter to everything you feel (but she is a child and you are the mature adult, right?) - have you ever tried to actually befriend this girl? A happy girl would not be acting like this and maybe she's actually begging for some positive attention - try asking her about her life - school, interests - be interested. I had a neighbor once (me white/she white) who was an extremely angry person, who acted out verbally on everyone in her family and in the neighborhood. She had a daughter (pre- teen/early teens when we lived next to them) who was clearly miserable and who took on her mother's behavior and was ready to get into it with absolutely anyone. I remember vividly one time she tried to get into it with me over some irrational totally minor thing and I refused to engage and instead talked with her rationally, calmly and in a friendly manner about the issue. She was visibly taken aback by this response and replied in kind. After that, she managed to squeeze out a smile and a few words of greeting when we'd pass each other. Poor thing. I'd suggest trying it. Joann

13-year-old's daily rages, may be bipolar - boarding school?

Sept 2006

Since fourth grade we've been trying to deal with a kid who is very angry on a daily basis, who steals, lies, does whatever possible to stir up trouble within our family. We've seen a host of mental health professionals: psychiatrist, evaluator, therapist, group therapist, family counselor, peer counselor, pediatrician specializing in ADHD, tried Depakote and Zoloft, spent thousands of dollars and seen no change or improvement in his behavior. (All of these appointments were researched and made by me; my husband has no faith in mental health professionals and I have to admit none of them so far have been effective.) At this point, I'm ready to get my son out of our home and into a boarding school or therapeutic boarding school. My husband doesn't want to send him away. I realize he's only 13 and that's really young but our family life is hell. He's not ''happy'' unless he's making everyone around him miserable, his daily rages make me cower, literally, and I have no idea what steps to take to change things. I'm open to advice but am especially hoping to hear from parents who have been through this. Could a boarding school improve my son's outlook and behavior or will it make him even harder and less cooperative? Anonymous


If your son has any chemical dependency issues (they can hide it well), that would be the first thing to deal with. We did the wilderness program route first - which changed things a lot for about 3 months, and now after major problems have cropped up again, we have our daughter in a local residential chemical dependency treatment program. She has lied, done poorly in school, run away, shoplifted, stolen a car etc... She is also a wonderful, smart and charming young woman who I miss terribly at this point in time. Our family is pretty functional. We have all done individual therapy and therapy as a family. Issues outside the home have included a father that left the state 8 years ago and a grandfather who molested her. Your son could be hiding a big secret that he is afraid to tell you or? I personally don't think these things spring out of nowhere, although there are weaknesses that get passed down in families like alcoholism. Good luck anon
If you even slightly think that your son may be bi-polar, I suggest you find a psychiatrist that specializes in this illness. Many regular psychiatrists don't know nearly as much as a specialist and sometimes are known for prescribing medication that acutally makes the bi-polar worse. I suggest calling Terrance Ketter who is the head of the bi-polar clinic at Stanford. If he doesn't treat adolescents, he will know who the experts are at Stanford who do work with this age group. I wish you the very best Annon.
Hi. I am experiencing with my daughter the same behaviour you are describing with your son. The behaviour has been always it is just more loud and intense now that she is a teenager. We are looking at Sensory Deprivation Disorder which basically means she is incredibly sensitive to incoming noise and light and cannot process too many verbal or nonverbal messages quickly. It makes for very defensive and angry reactions. An occupational therapist is helping her find practical ways to deal with this disorder as their are no drugs that really help anonymous
There are no magic bullets, but I think Dr. Mitchell Corwin can be helpful. He can provide assistance in both genetic nutritional testing (available thru Lafayette office) and helping parents choose appropriate therapy by differentiating what is emotional, neurological and learning problem. Dr. Corwin does something called applied kineseology, which I cannot explain - but call him. He has worked on both my children and my husband and myself and we have all found him helpful for various issues. Health Medicine Institute 3799 Mt Diablo Blvd (adjacent to Lafayette Reservoir) Lafayette CA 94549 (925) 962-3799 x310 Berkeley Office (across from Claremont Hotel) 2914 Domingo Ave Berkeley CA 94705-2454 (510) 845-3246 infolist[at]comcast.net
I am the mother of a very tricky child. We did a lot of alternative things to help. Through my experience, I ended up becoming a Jin Shin Jyutsu practitioner which deals with harmonizing energy in the body. The children that I work with have all improved in their behavior. Sometimes other things can be a factor and other alternative practitioners that I work with can come in to help. It sounds really, really frustrating. Feel free to call if you would like more information. Good luck Leah (510) 525-5080
It sounds like a very difficult time you are having, and I certainly hope things get much easier for you. I have expereienced some similar things with our 13 year old son. Things are better now, though not perfect. A couple of things that seemed to help were omega 3 fish oil (Ultimate Omega by Nordic Naturals--it is more concentrated that other fish oils) and EM Power Plus, a vitamin-mineral supplement made in Canada and used for a variety of mood disorders, and other mental health issues. You can find the fish oil at a good natural foods store and EM Power Plus on the internet at mytruehope.com. Best of luck to you anon
A therapeutic boarding school can be very helpful when other options have been exhausted (and exhausting!). However it is critical to choose the right place, since there are lots of places and even ones that other parents might recommend might not be appropriate for your son. I suggest you contact Bodin Associates http://www.bodinassociates.com/Vision/index.html . It is worth the price for their extensive experience and intimate knowledge of something like a hundred programs around the US. Robert
I think a real 'marker' of your son's condition is the way you clearly have to walk around on eggshells, just to co-exist. Because he's really young still, a special school, that is kind but firm and clear about boundaries, as well as helpful with regard to acceptable/unacceptable behaviors can make an ENORMOUS difference.

Because of the possibility that he would need to attend such a school that is not here in the Bay Area, it would be my advice to consult with the Bodin Associates in Lafayette. They specialize in just the situation you are experiencing. Been There, Done That - with Relative Success anonymous


for the mom with a possibly-bipolar, acting-out son:

my son fell apart in high school, and i can definitely relate to wanting to find some relief from the rages, acting out, all the drama in the family.

my husband and i also had a lot of anxiety and differences of opinion about what would help. far before i was willing to consider sending my son away, my husband was talking about that. i had to try various other things -- and it sounds like you have tried many things already.

have you considered consulting an educational therapist? we used bodin associates in lafayette [i think they also have an office on the peninsula], and it made a world of difference having outside people assess the situation and make a variety of recommendations.

bodin has lots of contacts will all sorts of programs -- local and away. we appreciated that the counselor we worked with had visted every place she recommended we consider, and knew people there. the assessment of our son was very individualized -- even though he was not very cooperative, they got records and talked to a lot of people who had worked with us and our son.

the whole process was kind of scary, but not as scary as continuing to live in the disaster our lives had become, and worrying constantly about how much worse it could get. [and it was really bad by the time we went to the consultant -- our son had 3 ER visits for substance problems in the previous year, and an involuntary psych commitment; he was nasty, and regularly went into rages where he tore up the house -- threatening us, kicking holes in walls, breaking things; was escorted home by police and detained by transit police; had bombed out of rehab; run away from home overnight a couple of times; stole from us; was caught with paraphrenalia at his new school; etc.]

the educational consultant recommended that we start with a very good therapeutic wilderness program -- not a boot camp, but a place where the kids learned self-reliance and to begin talking about stuff. even my son thinks that program was excellent. the staff was well trained. he was seen by a great therapist weekly; we exchanged mail via fax weekly; and his dad and i talked to the therapist for an hour weekly. after a few weeks, when he'd calmed down and adjusted, he had a battery of psychological tests. between that excellent report, his work with his group and his therapist, we got a better picture of what would help him along.

when our son was ready, my husband and i attended a ''transition camp'' -- an overnight trip to the wilderness with other kids [and parents] who were ''graduating.''

the educational consultant was in close touch with us and our son's therapist during the wilderness program, and came up with a lot of good recommendations about what to do next. we chose a therapeutic boarding school that was really good for our son's needs. he is not as enthusiastic about that choice, but it was really good for him -- he completed high school there, learned a lot, had a lot of fun, was able to keep up with his interest in music. he became himself again, only more mature. now he is a functioning, working adult of 19, a decent guy and holding his own. [we had expected he'd be in college, and i think one day he will be -- but he's alive and doing well, and we feared quite a lot that we would lose him, in the dark days.]

long story -- but try an educational consultant. they have so much more access to options than we mere mortal parents do, and it is truly a relief finding some options anonymous mom


You wrote that your son's ''daily rages make me cower, literally...'' So I have to say this first:

If you feel that your child *may* be a danger to himself or others (you included) get in touch with a mental health professional immediately.

I can't judge the situation from here and realize this may sound alarmist. But I am absolutely serious. Given your child's age, the issues of violence and suicide are absolutely real. As someone once said to me, ''it may only be a slight risk, but no one is only slightly dead.''

Now to where I began writing: I deeply sympathize with your plight. I have personal experience with your situation. This parenting experience is terrifying, baffling, emotionally exhausting and endlessly painful. What follows is based on knowledge I'd rather not have acquired. Please bear with its length if you can.

The problem with this kind of advice is the implicit assumption that one knows enough to offer specifics. I will try only to offer information, point out some relevant considerations, and describe what I believe is the best way to get help. There are no absolutes. Every step, every decision, is a judgment call. In particular cases, everything I will say could be dead wrong. With that caveat, here is my advice:

Sending your son to a boarding school will not solve his problems. To do so may be necessary, for reasons of safety or the well-being of your family as a whole. But regardless of where he is, your son's central issue is diagnosis. And placement decisions warrant caution. A wilderness program, for example, could be great for a kid with one set of problems but horribly destructive for a different one.

Thus, diagnosis is the first and critical step. But diagnosis means much more than labeling with a DSM-IV number. It requires a proper understanding of the individual child and the surrounding circumstances, careful observation, and thoughtful, experienced insight.

Without proper diagnosis, treatment is nothing but a random shot in the dark. ''First, do no harm,'' is the physician's maxim for very good reasons. Keep it foremost in your mind. With your child, compassion and tenderness is more likely called for than is ''tough love'' or blind adherence to social norms about how to raise children.

I know you've tried to crack this problem, and I know the financial and personal costs involved, but I strongly believe that you should try again and take a systematic, committed approach to diagnosis and treatment. To me, the fact that you've already tried so much only means that you face a tough problem, need excellent help and need to stay with it over time.

The situation you describe could have many origins, some psychiatric, some not -- an example of the latter is that the impact of neurocognitive or ''learning'' problems could lead to a secondary psychiatric condition like anxiety. Treating the anxiety is a palliative that alone doesn't solve the problem. These conditions are very difficult to understand, and understanding develops over time. Thus, it is better to stick with one team than to keep trying new players. Now some specifics:

1. ''Bipolar disorder'' is not the question, nor is it the answer. At best it is a mere label of convenience, as are all DSM-IV categories. These problems are not one-dimensional. They may involve genetic, biological, physiological, cognitive and social factors. That's why a really good diagnostic team is essential.

2. Fish oil? Please... Your child's life deserves more than voodoo medicine and home remedies. A supplement, maybe... An answer? No way.

3. This IS rocket science. You need to find and work with a team of two highly skilled and specialized professionals: a clinical psychologist and a psychiatrist.

4. The clinical psychologist is critically important to diagnosis -- even more than the psychiatrist. That is where to begin. Psychiatrists have a valuable set of skills and knowledge, but they aren't the best place to begin in the search for understanding. That's why in-patient units (like UCSF's Langley-Porter Institute) use a team approach that places the psychologist on an equal footing with the physician.

5. Treatment: I'm certainly not prescribing. All I can say is this... good treatment plans are multi-dimensional. In serious cases, mental health treatment includes a mix of individual and family therapy as well as medications, if called for. When physiological, neurocognitive or learning problems are involved, other components are needed as well.

6. Don't rule out medications just because you've tried some that didn't help. Meds are no panacea, but can be tremendously helpful. Even moderate improvement in your child's condition can make a huge difference in your life and his. But your physician, if competent, will be cautious. A medication regime frequently involves several drugs, and getting the dosages and balance right is complex. Watch closely for side effects. Remember also that the right meds prescribed for the wrong condition can exacerbate rather than alleviate symptoms.

7. Educational consultants? Yikes! This is way premature for the reasons above. Beyond that, and without commenting specifically on the one(s) mentioned (of whom I have no personal knowledge), I advise you to be cautious. I've heard more than one story about consultants who knew less than the parents who were paying them.

8. ATesting is the clinical psychologist's job, not that of an educational consultant. It is folly to rely on an ed consultant for diagnostic work.

9. I suspect your child may be having problems in school. Ask your school district for an evaluation of your child for special ed. You have that right even if he is in a private school. If you disagree with the district's evaluation you have the right to an independent evaluation at the school district's expense. This is a little-known right, but important for diagnostic as well as financial reasons. Special ed professionals will admit -- off the record -- that they don't have the tools or the time to do a full evaluation in difficult cases. Since an evaluation and simple report by a clinical psychologist runs $1500 to $3000 and up (well worth it), you may as well get the district to bear some of the burden. You've already spent tens of thousands, I suspect.

10. Some fear that special ed status stigmatizes their child. I disagree -- the impacts on self-esteem and social relationships of the problems that get children to special ed are far more harmful than any stigma that results. Special ed is by no means a perfect system, nor is it easy to navigate, but you can get significant financial help, including payment for a residential placement, if you work your way through the system. Here too, a clinical psychologist can help tremendously.

Finally, I can't say strongly enough how important it is to get top people on your child's team, especially given your description of the situation. Here are some recommendations to get you started. These are people I know and have confidence in. Obviously, there are others:

Clinical psychologists: Michelle Horton, Ph.D. (985-2958); Terry Doyle, Ph.D. (594-1926).

Psychiatrists: Robert Epstein, M.D. (848-0900); Shane MacKay (540-1746).

If it would be helpful, you may contact me through the Parents of Teens moderators -- Anonymous for now.


anonymous for now has a lot of thoughtful points.

one point, though, was a ''yikes!'' about finding an educational consultant. i'm one of the parents who suggested an educational consultant, and it was truly a turning point for us.

but i want to clarify, that is not where we started -- i made that suggestion because the parent asking about options for her son had already tried a lot of things. we tried talking to teachers, a family therapist, adolescent rehab, a new school that was very focused on students. we found a great adolescent psychiatrist -- but could not find a way to make our son go see that great doctor.

a year's worth of self-help yielded: 3 ER visits, one involuntary psych hospitalization, failing grades in 2/3 of our very bright son's classes, a 30 day inpatient rehab, his failing the outpatient rehab followup, several brushes with the police, being caught with paraphrenalia at his new school, being fired from the band he founded with good friends some years earlier, etc. the screaming. the holes in the walls. stuff he stole. the runaways. it was a complete nightmare. and i have a smart, very decent kid -- he lost himself, and we could not bring him back without serious help.

we turned to educational consultants when we had no more decent options, and it opened doors. we could not even get a good assessment of what was going on with our son, because he would not comply or cooperate on an outpatient basis. and our family life was in flames for quite a long time -- the worst part lasted a full year, even with the best interventions we could invent and patch together.

there is no down side to talking with an educational consultant. they have heard it all. there is no way for parents to easily navigate the local or away options without some help from people who know about programs -- and one piece of the programs they can suggest involves getting a handle on diagnosis.

to answer another issue -- the ed consultants do NOT do diagnosis themselves. they can recommend appropriate people, or see that a kid gets the appropriate evaluation at where ever he or she goes.

my own son had two kinds of very excellent evaluations at his therapeutic wilderness camp, where he spent 9 weeks -- one from a therapist who saw him weekly, was in close contact with the people who saw my son constantly, and also consulted with us -- and probably the best psychological evaluation based on testing that i've ever seen [and i see quite a few in my work]. the wilderness place was extremely supportive. i still feel that we could have struggled for years more, and never gotten as decent an assessment at home. my son, too, feels the therapeutic wilderness experience was really, really good for him -- he sees it more as a chance he had to grow and to believe in himself. [he was NOT happy about going there, but was VERY happy with how far he had come by the time he left, 9 weeks later.] anonymous mom


My 16-year-old daughter won't speak to me

May 2006

I'm having a horrible time with my 16 year old daughter. She has done nothing but glare, snarl and refuse to speak to me for over a month now.

This started with an increase number of unexcussed absences at school. I responded by cutting off her cell phone (I thought just until she started going back to classes regularly). She responded with even worse attendance (she's missed at least one class a day for almost six weeks now and is failing at least two classes as a result) and has refused to talk to me at all. I'm just gritting my teeth and trying to cope with living with a continuous stream of hatred.

There have been a number of substantial stresses at home, so this problem is not 100% out of the blue. I've suggested counseling, but she became enraged at that idea and took off. I ultimately called the police to help find her that night. Any suggestions? anonymous


Your daughter may be having more serious problems than just cutting school. My daughter was also cutting class a lot and it turned out that she was drinking, smoking and doing drugs. In our case it got so bad that she spent a week at Herrick and then 6 weeks in a wilderness program before things started to turn around. We now have her in a small private school that she loves (and that we can't afford) and she is attending NA meetings almost daily. She goes to therapy once a week as well. There are still issues, but things are better. Family therapy could be very helpful if she would go anon
That sounds hard! You might suggest going to family therapy. If you say that there are other things going on at home it might be a good thing all around. You might say to her ''it's not that SHE'S the problem, but that you ALL have some things to work out and need to find better ways of communicating with each other. Sounds like she's really unhappy about something and it would sure be great if she could get it off her chest to feel better.'' You could try someone who does art therapy also. It will take the spotlight off her. I can recommend Ava Charney-Danesh in El Cerrito ever-hopeful mom of teen
Family therapy would be a primary recommendation, both for the situation and because family therapy is one of the most effective forms of treatment. If you can find a good therapist he or she will take the pressure off your daughter by involving the whole family. You can talk with the therapist on the phone about any worries you might have in trying to get her to participate in therapy. And if - as you said - there are stresses at home those could (and should) be addressed as well. Robert
My heart goes out to you! Your daughter is definitely rebellious and pushing her/your boundaries.

I ask you this: 1) take a step back - what is your relationship with her, she is obviously in need of attention and help but does she have an outlet for that (if not you, an aunt or someone)?

2) are the only/most interactions between you two hostile and negative?

My suggestion is this - Discipline w/out ANGER. Give her consequences for her actions, set the expectations clearly (no missing class, or no new clothes or cell, allowance for a SET amount of time, take away again if she re- offends). Tell her when she is capable of making her own decisions she will be allowed to do so, but right now she is not showing that ability.

The part kids hate is the unexpectedness we often impose in our punishments and the LASHING out and BERATING we end up doing out of FEAR and WORRY - they don't see fear and worry as love, they just see/hear the ANGER and ''you don't understand me'' parts.

Then you have to grin and bear her negative behavior and show her you are not affected by it and her escalating that will not affect you either (so it's not beneficial to her to continue it). Your ''matter of fact'' attitude will yield shock and dividends in terms of her NOT knowing how to react. Even the title of your post shows us she is pushing your buttons well - Don't focus on her NOT talking to YOU, Focus on your child having a bad time at making the right decisions.

also, don't let your fear run you ragged - we can drive ourselves nuts sometimes and the kids always think we are overreacting.

Then at all possible times, give her encouragement, point out what she is doing well.

Good luck to you - try meditation, reading good books on meditation and some ''you'' time as well let your love shine thru


My step-daughters, 13 & 17, are angry and violent

Sept 2005

We have 3 teen daughters, 13, 15, 17. My bio daughter, 15, is 60% here and 40% with her Dad. Good Dad. My 2 stepdaughters, 13 & 17, live with us full time, have been and continue to be abandoned by their mother. She has no custody of the 17 yr old, and every other weekend of the 13 yr old, for which she often doesn't show. Or suddenly brings them back after 2 hours. They are very angry, screaming, throwing things, violent, have left bruises on me. We told them they would have to attend anger management classes (yet to be found) (we would go too). They refused, screaming ''make me'', grabbing my arm and even trying to force me out of the house. My husband backs me up but the situation is untenable. We need help fast. Have called the police once already. It mostly seems like huge power struggles. Groups for teens for anger management/blendedfamily issues? Thanks. Waiting for the next time. Things are calm at this moment, but cycles of anger. Any advice or suggestions for classes, groups, therapists very much appreciated.


My brother and sister-in-law struggled with similar issues with their daughter. Since you mention that you had called the police once, I want to pass along some advice that was given to them. In order to avoid getting your kid into the criminal justice system if you have to call the police for help, be very careful about how you speak with them. One professional gave this advice: ''In the future, when the parents call 9-1-1 they should request that ''a police officer come to assist at the home of a mentally ill person that is in danger of harming herself and others.'' They should identify themselves as the parents of a minor. In Ohio, the only emergency personnel that can admit a mentally ill individual who is a risk to himself or others are the police or mental health personnel (Ohio Revised Code Section 5122.10). Often, if a child is in danger of hurting self/others, the police transport the children to an area mental health hospital (or general hospital if no mental health hospital is nearby) where they are held for evaluation, observation and treatment. [Note: a person held in a general hospital must be either treated and released or transported to a mental health unit within 24 hours.] ''

Although this person is talking about Ohio, I'm betting it works similarly here. You might want to research it a bit. If you can avoid the criminal justice system, you are more likely to have a successful outcome and get your family the support it needs. Good luck and hang in there. Diane


15-year-old is angry, depressed and fat: help!

Nov 2004

We live in Marin and my son is a l5 year old H.S. sophomore. He is opposed to any kind of intervention and gets extremely angry when any suggestions are sent his way. He's been diagnosed with depression and takes lexapro. His psychiatrist went to Kaiser last year and my son will not see anyone else. His grades are poor and he was recently caught cheating at school. Has anyone had experience with psych. testing or neuropsych. testing - would it provide some useable information about my son? I already know what's wrong: just not how to engage him into making things better. He defines the word ''resistant''.


15 year old angry teens are hard to help. I suggest getting some support for you as the parent---in order to help him as best you can through this difficult phase of life (for both of you!) My daughter had very difficult freshman and sophomore years in high school and also took an anti-depressant.

She did have psychological testing and I think it was most UNHELPFUL. In my opinion, it doesn't help to have a disinterested outsider add some labels to an already difficult situation.

What does help? Well, if you can find an adult (teacher, religious leader, school counselor, life coach) that your son does trust, perhaps even bribe or cajole him to see a couple, that would be great.

Exercise---is there anything or anyone he likes to get outside with? (dogs, horses?) Teen meditation at Spirit Rock (a very accepting environment).

My daughter really resented the notion that she needed ''therapy''. Perhaps a good ''life coach'' if your son reacts positively to the notion of ''coaching.'' Good luck. Hang in there. Keep him safe. Try not to judge him. Love him. Love yourself. We mostly all make it through the teenage years---painful as they may be.

Wish there were an instruction manual


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