• My friends don't want to hang out with my kids
• Friends growing distant while I'm pregnant
• Are we alone in preferring our new baby to our old friends?
• Waning old friendships and making new mom friends
• My closest pre-baby friendships have ended or changed
• See also: How to Find New Friends
• More Advice about Adult Friendships

My friends don't want to hang out with my kids

I was supposed to have brunch with two friends of mine, but found out a couple of days prior that my husband would be out of town that Sunday and I couldn’t get a babysitter on short notice. I told my friends I couldn’t make brunch, unless I could bring the kids. I added that since I was going to be alone all day with the kids (age 2 and 4) maybe they could come over to the East Bay (they live in SF) and hang out with us for the day. Their response was “Let’s reschedule brunch.” This is most infuriating to me because they are always offering to come over (“Oh, I really want to see the kids!”), but when I actually pin them to a date, something always comes up. The last excuse was a raging hangover. One of the friends is my daughter’s godmother, and she hasn’t seen my daughter since January, and that was only because I brought the kids to her Super Bowl party.

Am I being a total brat? I don’t expect them to babysit or take care of the kids, but just keep me company while I am watching the kids, maybe get to know them. I don’t know how to approach it, because inside I am so pissed – all I can see is their selfishness. Please give me insight into my bitterness. I feel like the tables will turn when we are old, and I have my two darling adult children…and they are alone. And have cirrhosis of the liver because they will be drinking themselves to death. Bitter

I think it's important that you recognize this and move forward. I don't think there would be anything wrong with having a nice conversation (when you aren't so pissed) about it ~ WITH EXAMPLES but haven't confirmed a date'' ''I want to hang out with you AND my kids at the same time, for example our brunch date, but you didn't'' .... Then you have to be GRACIOUS and STRONG enough to hear what they have to say. Maybe they really don't like your kids. (I know, how could they not, but :) .... you never know) Maybe restaurants and kids don't mix with them. You never know what it might be. Maybe they don't like the way you are around your kids. Maybe they're jealous. It could be some really yucky stuff that you don't need/want to hear. Or maybe, you're right, they are just selfish. You have to decide if you really want to know that.

Then, move forward. Know that these are your ''no kids'' friends and you don't include your kids in your relationship with them. Maybe in the future they will grow up and become great with your kids. You don't know, but unfortunately you cannot make them something they are not.

I wish you the best, I know these transitions are difficult! change is hard

In short, I would say that the answer to that is a resounding ''yes.'' I don't know you at all, but you sound quite angry. Maybe your kids aren't really well enough behaved for other adults to want to have to spend time with you when you have your kids. That thought certainly came to mind when I read the tone of your post.

Good luck to you. Glad it's not me

Your friends have chosen a different life than you have. You are happy with your choices, they are happy with theirs. Why should your friends have to spend time with kids if they don't enjoy it? Why should you have to go out drinking if you don't enjoy it? Make family plans with other families. Make going out plans with other adults. Might be time to find new friends

My only advice is to try to understand that most people without kids do not understand the lives of people who do. They are selfish about their time because they have not yet had to devote themselves to another human being. If they ever have kids, that may change; if they don't, that may still change at some point, or not. Try to let them go for now, develop new friendships with other parents if possible, and wait for your friends to come back around, or drift away. It's not worth it to feel bitter. (Which, if you are like me, is partially just jealousy that you no longer have the same freedoms. But you DO have your wonderful kids, which, like you said, they do not.) Speaking of my selfish friend: once, in a moment of honesty, she told me that she couldn't be around her friends with kids because she felt too sad that she didn't have any herself. Yes, still self-centered, but perhaps your friends are also suffering from feeling like they are missing out on the relationship/children part of life?? If that's a possibility, maybe try to be more compassionate? anon

Honestly, I have kids and certainly don't want to hang out with you while you watch your kids (unless mine are along). Minding the monsters just isn't a fun social activity for me as I imagine it isn't for your friends. In a couple of years, your kids will be able to sit through baseball games or other fun things and your friends may be more inclined to hang with them for longer periods. -don't get bitter...

With that said, however, I do think you might want to take a step back and consider the fact that perhaps your friends' intentions were not to imply that they don't like your kids. It sounds like it might very well be possible that they simply wanted to spend uninterrupted gal-time with YOU! :) There is no doubt that 2 & 4 are busy, demanding ages. No matter how accustomed those of us with children have become to the fast- pace and constant activity of having a couple little ones (even well-behaved) in-tow, it is a simple fact that this buzz is usually enough to make people with grown kids thankful that their kids are gone and single folks thankful to be flying solo. :)

Remember that your friends love you for YOU. They most certainly respect you as a mother, but it doesn't mean that they don't miss you as a girlfriend. Rescheduling your brunch for another day without the kids, is a gift to you as well... We mothers get so little time to ourselves! Mom of 2, too

Now the only thing I can say is that when my sister had kids and I was not yet married, I really found it hard to spend time with her because I couldn't get a word in edgewise (she has a lot of kids), she never asked me how I was doing - she could only manage to talk about her kids or her husband, and she corrected me everytime I said something to the kids.

I am sure you don't do that stuff and your friends are just LAZY and SF-centric. No one from SF ever came to visit me in Oakland unless they had a really good reason.

So, your friends are lazy, and for sure don't understand how exhausting it is to have kids and how nice it is to have people just come hang out. If I were you, I would talk with them at some point - maybe over a margarita when you are all loosened up a little. Say something like ''I'm really sad that I don't get to see you guys that much - I can't just put the kids in the closet and go out - but I'd love to be able to hang out a little more.''

I don't know, that sounds hard, maybe just get new friends. :) Elizabeth

Now my friends are ones who either have kids or who are more sympathetic people and can relate to kids.

I guess it's just part of living in this modern world! anon mom

My advice: hang with other parents and their kids on days when you are going solo with your kids. anon

Are these friendships are important to you? Try hard to put yourself in your friends' shoes: they have been downgraded in importance in terms of your attention, so a trip across the Bay Bridge doesn't seem like it will offer much of the kind of friendship they may crave from you. You could try to have a heart-to-heart about what works for them regarding get-togethers with or without kids. I sometimes go with mom friends and their kids to museums, parks, or playgrounds. As your children get older and less needy, I also think you will find that get-togethers with your old friends are much easier. In the meantime, try to find more ways to spend time in a way that works for both of you, so the friendship stays warm. Been There

While people may like kids, it doesn't mean they always feel like hanging out with them. I'm a nanny and most of my friends have kids, so I gotta deal with it to hang out with them. But with my free time, sometimes I just don't feel like spending time with kids, which is Why I Don't Have My Own, so that it is always my option. Just like your friends... I would NEVER accept an invite to spend a whole day with my friends AND their children. Maybe 1-2 hours, sure. But kid-free people tend to get overwhelmed with kid chaos. You are asking and expecting too much of them. I think it's great that they know themselves enough to steer clear of breeding, since it's not the life they really want. Why are they selfish for not being in the mood to be around kids? You made the choice to have kids. Good for you. But they didn't, so respect them for where they're at.

There is also the issue of expectation. They're planning and looking forward to adult interaction - they're probably bummed that they don't get to see (just) you this time. Considering how many parents lose their non-breeding friends (maybe for exactly this difference?), pat yourself on the back that your personality is so interesting to them that they continue to maintain the relationship (obviously they don't realize how evil you really are).

I don't drink, but if I had a raging hangover, I'd cancel whatever our plans were too! Are you sure you're not somewhat upset because you can't live your life according to your whim anymore, but your friends still can?

Well, I've been on both sides. I have an older teenager now. I guess I'd just say a no-kids brunch with friends is way different than a day in the living room with one, and you were asking to change the whole tone of the thing. Plus, a whole day? This may sound awful, but I loved my kid at all ages, I loved hanging out with other parents with kids all before and after pre-school hours endlessly, I loved other kids, I became deaf to screaming, whining, fights, never being able to finish a darn adult sentence or thought... all that. I even used to be a teacher, loved those kids too.

Now if I have a choice - PASS! No thanks! That hormone or whatever that kicks in that allows us to be fascinated by baby poop and screaming, childless people don't have. And once past it, I personally don't have it any more either. Seeing a cute neighbor kid on the sidewalk, I have about a 5-minute tolerance.

I'd say one day (even an hour) plus a big drive is way too much to ask of your friends. They don't owe you anything. You're probably misdirecting your bitterness at being overworked and sleep deprived onto these innocent friends who have easier lives. Jealousy is totally understandable. I like it when the underside of parenting comes out in public like this, so we can drop the guilt of hating how hard it is sometimes!

I'd say find friends in similar straits. Don't wish ill on these gals. Make the effort for them when you can and keep inviting. Anon

Maybe your children are great kids and your friends just really don't want the everyday inconveniences of children while they relax for brunch. Maybe your children are difficult to deal with and you are immune to that while your friends really don't want to deal with behavior problems.

You cannot expect people to make room for the choices you have made in life. However, if they don't celebrate those choices with you, they may not be friends worth keeping in the long run. mar

But, I also know how it feels when you have kids and suddenly lose all your friends. It's like their a disease or something and no one wants to be near you! The sad thing is that unfortunately I think single people and people with kids just don't have a lot in common. Of course there are always single people that can make that leap to understand your world, but for most of us that's really hard. Hopefully your friends will have kids at some point and will understand your position better. In the meantime, just accept that you won't be seeing them as much and look for other friends who you have more in common with right now. It doesn't mean losing them, it's just having them be in a different place in your life. Kids change a lot in our lives, and friendships is one of them. anon

Friends growing distant while I'm pregnant

I am a first time pregnant Mom to be and I am experiencing some distance with my girlfriend relationships. The intellectual part of me knows this is natural, but the emotional part of me feels hurt and a little isolated. Although I'm 33, I'm one of the first in my circle of friends to become pregnant. Other friends are waiting or ambivalent about having children. They have become distant, not checking in as frequently as we used to with eachother. Although I'm pregnant, I am still me, and I feel written off.

I have sought out other pregnant Mom's and Mom's with children and I am developing these new friendships. I just miss my old friends, we have been through a lot together, and I hoped to go through this experience with them. Missing my girls

I've thought a lot about why. I think sometimes people have things going on in their own lives that make it hard to deal with a friend's pregnancy. (I later found out one friend was dealing with infertility.) And for the others, my only guess is it felt like such a monumentous thing in my life that they couldn't share, so they pulled back. But you'd think they'd still know to send a present. I'm still hurt.

I think once your baby is born, it'll be easier to find new friends with children. Being pregnant is sort of an in-between stage and it can be hard to feel like you have all that much in common with parents. It's funny, I think people blame parents for pulling away from childless friends and forming new friendships, but in my experience it was the other way around. Sorry to hear you're going through this. anon

Why this happens I have a few ideas: many women, especially women in their late 20's (as I was) and early 30's are really anxious, nervous, and hyper-aware of their own biological clocks ticking. Having a best friend who becomes pregnant is sometimes too much to bear. It's like having their noses rubbed in the fact that they haven't found that special person yet with whom they want to start a family. And it's a very blatant reminder of their deep desire for children and a family.

I also think that some women feel uncomfortable with the idea that the relationship they once had is now going to change forever (or at least for a long time). My girlfriends and I went out at night, did a lot of partying, a lot of sleeping around, a lot of sleep overs with manicures, face masks, and talking until wee hours. It was sad for me to know those days were ending, but I knew they wouldn't last. For some of my girlfriends, they still are acting the same as when we were 22. My life has changed dramatically. So there is a bit of a disconnect there. And perhaps some women don't want to feel immature, or as if their life is stagnant. Hanging out with a married/knocked-up friend may make some people feel like their own lives aren't as ''together'' as they want them to be.

I know it seems really lonely and you feel sad. The best I can offer is to confront your friends, tell them how you feel. If they change their tune, great, if not, realize that there will be others who come along. jo

Anyway, in my case, our friendship survived this fork in the road. Happily, when *I* had a baby nine years ago, we reconnected (my friend is a fabulous person and didn't hold it against me) and are now closer than ever. Good luck! Fran

At any rate, it's good that you are meeting new people who will have more in common with you for a while. For sure, once your friends get to your phase, you will find yourselves talking to them a lot more again.

You could also just ask what's up - at least then you'll know what's going on. Pregnancy and fertility are tricky topics - they bring out a lot of emotions in people. Maybe it's a chance to connect on a deeper level, who knows? Good luck. Been there

Enjoy your pregnancy-- you will never be pregnant for ''the first time'' again. And soon enough, you will have this beautiful baby to take care of and everything will fall into perspective. If your friends choose not to involve themselves, it's their loss. This baby will be a blessing of love and light and everyone benefits from that.... LogicalMama

- Try to reach out MORE to now-distant friends, about things you (used to) care about. Remember that, even if you don't mean to, you're likely all about belly size and kick counts and Dr. Sears and BabiesRUs all this baby crap that your old friends don't know about and are - at best, scared of, and at worst, insanely jealous of.

- DO make new friends with other pregnant women and moms with kids ~ your age. Work hard at this. You will need them - because they will know or know how to find answers to the 1,001 'little questions' you will have in the next 6 months.

- Include your partner in your life/love/fears/hopes discussions - you'll need this person a LOT once the baby comes; might as well start the emotional rollercoaster now. :) Good luck! New Mom Feelin' For Ya!

We lived in New Orleans when we had our child and our friends just could not ''get'' that we couldn't party til 4am... not because we didn't want to or couldn't get a sitter, but because we would DIE of exhaustion from getting up the next day. This may be a hard and sad time for you losing your girlfriend group like that, but (a) you will get them back when they have kids and (b) you will meet wonderful mommy friends who ''get'' what you are doing and why you are doing it. And at the end of the day your life will be filled with all of these people... maybe playing different roles than they once did. Good luck! Jenny

That being said, I feel so much more fulfilled now that I have new women friends who have a lot in common with me; one should never underestimate the bond of motherhood. Although it is sad to lose touch and feel like your old childless friends aren't interested anymore, by the time you have your baby and have gone through pregnancy, labor, the newborn period, and the toddler years with the support of other moms who have done the same thing, you will have friendships the nature of which you probably can't imagine now. Not that they can replace the old friendships, but at least it's something new and tremendously rewarding in its own right. This may sound cheesy, but I liken it to having a ''tribe'' almost; it feels like this is what primitive women do when they sit around and talk and cook or work and the kids all play together and stay out of your hair. Very natural and satisfying. Good luck! --Love my new mom friends

Are we alone in preferring our new baby to our old friends?

Please bear with me through this soap opera: I heard that having a child will strain certain friendships and strengthen others. Well, my wife and I were friends with a young woman for a few years before having a kid, and since the appearance of our daughter (she's 7 months old now), this friend of our has grown to be more and more of a burden.

As new parents, our priorities have shifted radically - there is just no way we can go on an all-day hike with her, nor can we come over for dinner or go out for a movie. Truth be told, we're hardly interested in things like that anymore. Our priority is the baby and each other. This friend's reply is ''other people have babies and have a life too''; then she tries to load us with guilt as though all these difficulties in our friendship are the result of us simply not wanting to be around her anymore. Talk about a self-fulfilling prophecy!

What's worse, she's obsessed about her upcoming marriage, and we don't have any time or desire to share in it.

We do have a friend who fits in well with our new baby, who helps out when we need help or just comes by to spend time with all three of us. Needless to say, our other friend is intensely jealous of this relationship and has grown ever more upset. It's just not any fun at all being with her anymore, but we don't know what to do about it. For my part, I've tried telling her that relationships do change, but that doesn't mean they stop - they change and grow, too. But I don't think she paid attention.

So do I consider this friendship a casualty of our new baby? How do you know when it's time to ''break up'' with a friend? What are some similar experiences you BPNers have had? Are we alone in preferring our kid to many (but not all of our) old friends? Happy Parents, Few Friends

It is okay to live in a new mom fog for a while...we've all been there. At some point though, you are going to want to rejoin the rest of the world. -anon

I did, however, want to be as kind as I could about it, and I eventually decided that writing her a letter (not an email, btw, a real letter) was the best way to explain how I was feeling and why I needed to stop seeing her. I told her all the ways I admired her and enjoyed her and wanted the best for her, but that what she wanted from me wasn't something I had to give at this stage in my life. She wrote back saying that she understood, and we haven't seen each other for several years. I imagine I may be friends with her again one day, but I don't know.

Only you can decide what's right for you to do in your situation. For me, it was the right thing and I've felt good about it. There is so much stress in being a new parent that it seems smart to me to remove any sources of stress you can. Good luck

It's great to revel in the pleasure of having a new baby, but when you say you prefer being with your baby to being with most of your old friends, I worry about your future as a couple, and your daughter's future as the object of all your adoration. Babies grow up and develop their own social lives and if you've dispensed with all your friends in order to devote yourself to adoring your baby, you're in for a lonely time of it. Friends are a valuable commodity, but you have to treat them well if you want to keep them.

Explain your limitations clearly to your friend (e.g we really need to go home by 7:30, because Fiona tends to melt after that) but try being more giving to her as well.

There's no way she can understand your experience -- no one without kids can understand. But are you trying to understand her's? You sound pretty selfish in your post when you say that you're just not interested in her upcoming marriage. Not interested? Yeesh. It's her WEDDING for Christ's Sake, it's a big life changing event for her, just like your baby is to you. If you can't work up a little enthusiasm, I'd say she's better off without the friendship. Nelly

It looks to me that friendship to you comes out of convenience only and is not something you respect much. You also suggest this friend is wanting to keep the same type of relationship you all used to have (which doesn't include the baby) but then you suggest you don't care to share in her marriage plans. She is about to do something that's very important in a person's life and you don't care to participate... great friend you are.

And, you say you like this other new friend better, among other things, because she comes over and helps.... Interesting. Friendship is a two way street and friends are not there just for your convenience. Do her a favor and don't be her 'friend' anymore. Would-never-want-to-be-your-friend

While you and your wife are blissfully happy with your lives and your baby, I'm sure she's feeling like she is losing a couple of good friends. Afterall, you three did lots of things together before the baby came along.

It would be good to invite her over oneday, and just talk about how things have changed. I think you owe it to the past friendship to make this one last gesture of communication. She may completely understand where you are coming from and there will be no hard feelings. She might gain new insight and decide take you up on those ''come over and just hang out'' nights. She may just frankly not understand that you guys just want to be homebodys.

But if you don't talk to her, there will be lots of hurt feelings. And, from the sound of things, she has already tried to tell you that she is hurt and missing your friendship.

Single people shouldn't have to lose their friends because of marriage and a baby. C-

Now, about this 'friend'. It's OK for her to feel sad that your relationship has changed because of your child, but making you feel guilty about it is not something a good secure friend would or should do. (I know some of our childless friends feel bad about our changed relationships, but they never give us guilt trips. They know our lives have changed.) I think it may be time to 'break up' with her, because she isn't being a good friend, you don't enjoy her guilt trips, and you obviously can't be what she wants or expect in a friend. i don't know how you would do this. The alternative is to sit down for a heart-to- heart chat with her and spill you guts (gently) about how you feel. Perhaps she will feel better knowing that it's not her but your baby that has changed your priorities and maybe she'll stop guilt-tripping. just a thought. I guess I want to say don't feel bad for not wanting to be friends with this person anymore, and having kids does change your life and your friendships. Anon

When our son turned about 5 mos, we had more energy and time to research resources - learned about Tot Drop and babysitting co-ops, etc. Then, we started to make more room for adult lives, activities, adult friends, etc. Our society doesn't make family-friendly resources and support a priority. (Read any of Judith Warner's stuff on being a parent in Paris vs. U.S.?) So, cut the couple some slack. They'll find their way and realize that their lives need to make more room for adults, etc. Right now they're protecting their new family unit. And, it's very possible that they don't have the energy that they used to to give to friendships that are not of the give-and-take, non-high maintenance, non-toxic variety. Of course, this is my interpretation; but, as I said - there's probably more history to this, but I'm going to assume the positive and that they're not as selfish as some decided. positive spinner

Waning old friendships and making new mom friends

As a new Mom, I naively thought my old friendships (15+ yrs)would strengthen with our now shared motherhood experience. Unfortunately, the opposite seems to be occurring. I am grieving this change and looking to make some new mom friends – “real”, supportive connections. As a SAHM, I feel isolated sometimes. Two of my old friends are unstructured and lead more chaotic lives than we like to. While I am flexible and sometimes too accommodating, I am responsible and pretty organized. These two girlfriends have become even more flakey since having children – setting up time to see each other just leaves me frustrated and disappointed. (Another note – we don't live in the same areas, so there is a little effort in coordinating get-togethers) My other close friend is prego w/ her first and a pretty intense career woman and doesn’t really get my decision to stay home for a period of time. I realize that it isn’t personal – but sad/disappointing on some level. As Moms, we have different values and approaches – which have become greater obstacles than during our pre-family lives.

Also, I’ve done a decent job trying to meet other moms in SF. I realize friendships take time to nurture. I am the “coordinator” of my playgroup, tried to organize a mom neighborhood get-together, but what I’ve discovered is that many moms are so busy/over-scheduled these days. There hasn’t been a lot of reciprocation, but on the positive side, I have made a few new mom friends that I hope may deepen – right now they’re pretty casual. Interestingly, these new friends are more likely to be open and honest about their experiences as a new mom, unlike my old buddies, which has been surprising to me, which I cannot really explain.

I’ve never struggled making friends – particularly pre-baby; I seem to have made quite a few new friends at the local playground with the Latina nannies which has helped my Spanish. I’d welcome some honest, constructive input - advice, resources (books, etc) or reality check (Am I over thinking/feeling – being too sensitive?). Should I let my old friendships run their natural course? Maybe I have an unrealistic and idealistic view of what to expect? Maybe focus on re-engaging with my pre-baby interests, volunteering & work? SF Mom

Yet, some of what you said was a bit much. As you well know, juggling life and baby is hard, hard work. So they aren't as organized as you. A bit chaotic. What do you care about their personal style? Maybe they are having a really tough time at it. Maybe they actually feel best with a little bit of chaos in their lives. Frankly you sound very judgemental about their parenting (or any parenting that isn't like your parenting), and there's just no rational basis for it. Believe it or not, you aren't the world's best mother. Your methods aren't the world's best methods. There are A LOT of ways to raise a child well, with love and care. And its most important to find a good fit so that mommy and baby are both happy and lessed stressed out. If these are your friends, then cut them some slack. Maybe they think you are acting like the CEO of Motherhood, yet they aren't (presumably) wanting to end their friendship with you because of it. To me, it sounds like all of this is coming from a place of insecurity on your part. You have a hard time handling other ways of parenting because you are, at some level, unsure of yourself as a parent and need the self and other validation that your methods are so correct that a parent with any other lifestyle is not even worth being friends with. Be a little easier with yourself. Parenting is tough, but its much more an art than a science. I'm sure that you - and your friends - are doing a fine job. Toddler Mom

To me, your request for advice reflected a profound sense of loneliness & frustration at having your attempts to reach out seemingly rebuffed. You sound like a positive, extroverted person who finds herself unable to connect with anyone right now.

Trust me, your feelings are valid, but I promise that this wretched stage of isolation will pass. We love our kids to death, yet early motherhood is awfully danged hard, exhausting, lonely & isolating. Infants & toddlers have unpredictable feeding/sleep schedules & moods which make it difficult for even the most organized & socially-motivated parents to stay in touch with old friends & connect with new ones.

All I can say is: hang in there, keep making social overtures (folks do & WILL appreciate them even if they're too overwhelmed to respond right now), find ways to nurture yourself in the meantime, & seek out more casual social outlets so you don't feel too dreadfully lonely while waiting for old friendships to redevelop & new ones to develop. Your reaching out will definitely pay off later -- both for you & the parents & children lucky enough to befriend you.

As you & your friends gain experience as parents & the children get a bit older, you'll gravitate towards each other again, plus, you'll make new friends too through playgroups, classes, preschool, school, etc. Once the kids are down to one nap a day, are entirely or mostly weaned from nursing, start talking, & can stay dry for 2-4 hour stretches, your social lives will pick up, I swear Formerly desolate mom

My closest pre-baby friendships have ended or changed

Since having a baby about a year ago, I feel like some of my most important, closest friendships (mostly with people also having babies) have changed in ways I don't exactly understand, and I'm not sure what to do about it. Some friendships have ended, and some have just become more shallow. This has happened with women friends, and with couple friends as well. It hurts--it feels kind of like being in junior high. To make things worse, I'm being really hard on myself about these changing friendships--as if I have done something terribly wrong--rather than accepting this as something that might easily happen to people who are tired, busy, and immersed in caring for babies.

I love being a mom but I feel like I am becoming more isolated from people my age, which concerns me, as I don't feel like I have much of a support system at the moment. Throughout my life, I've been a good friend to others and had good friends in return, but I'm kind of an introvert and don't make close friends easily.

So, because I feel like I'm the only one who's had this happen, what I'm looking for is support. Has this happened to anyone else after having kids? How did you deal with it? Is it normal to have friendships change (in ways you don't like) after motherhood? Pre-baby, I had visions of having my child play with my friends' kids for years and years, but now, I don't feel like I am really friends with some of my friends anymore. Any kind words of wisdom would help, as I'm having a hard time getting perspective on the situation. Sad Mom

This has been frustrating at times for me, but I try to be understanding of the limitations my friends feel they have in their lifes. Since I'm still interested in the friendships and like my kids to play with other kids, I've decided that as long as I have the energy, I'll take the initiative to get together with our friends and don't try to expect much in return. Another strategy that has helped has been to make friends with neighbors, for some reason being closer by seems to make things much easier, whether is setting up a play-date or a pot-luck...

The last thing that has also helped me is to try to get together only with my girlfriends, when the kids are sleeping or cared for by another adult. We get together everytime we can work a schedule out, and it is a great opportunity to have fun, enjoy uninterrupted conversations, and vent some of our common frustrations...

I feel that frienships tend to become more difficult once one has a kid because of the limited time, both to nurture the friendships and to make new ones. My friends who have kids who are older also went through a readjustment period when they had kids and now have actually revived much of their old friendships... so maybe we can just hope that it's only a period of our lives?? Anon.

so all my fantasies about my kids playing with friends kids have vanished because in many cases because we don't see eye to eye on child rearing. i hear about the frustrations of one parent or the other, so it just makes it awkward when we are all together, a child is crying and you know all the ''background'' conflict going on about how one person is handling a situation...

i haven't found a good solution other than trying my best to let my friends know it's ok that we do things differently and i think we're all sort of getting over it. i figure i can meet more like minded parents when my child is in preschool...we'll see. good luck

I had visions of making lots of new friends, with my moms' group members, with other parents of children sharing the same daycare provider etc. (I had heard that it's easy to make friends with other moms) and this has not been the case either.

It comes down to this, I think: friendships require energy. Good, strong, deep friendships require a lot of energy. When one has kids, they take up most of our energy. We ration what's left, and have superficial relationships with people we come into contact with while managing our children's days, and/or a couple of good friendships with people with whom we are close enough that it's worth the energy involved. Sad, it seems, but I've not found any way around it. Karen

I had my daughter 3 years ago in SF and when she was 6 mos old, we moved to Oakland. I lost all of my friends who I thought were very close to me. That was a lot of people! No one visited and it seemed like no one cared. I was so depressed! But, after about a year or so, things shifted. We were introduced to friends of friends who have kids. Also, when our daughter started day care, we met some other parents and exchanged ideas and phone numbers. Made a few play dates. Things just naturally took it's course. Now, we have a great network of friends in the East Bay and haven't really given SF a second thought! (Who needs then anyway!)

Once I established some connections with others, i didn't feel the need to be with anyone else but, my own child and husband. And the occasional dinner party was something so wonderful to look forward to! Might I suggest you pool together the few remaining friends that seem interested and throw a small dinner party...or a brunch, perhaps. It might just give you that edge to put your feelers out and see who's still in the mix with you. And as you metnioned, maybe everyone is just TOO BUSY! I know I am! But, it's worth a shot, no? tinygirl

The upside is that I have made many new friends since the birth of my son. I also have tended to be shy and make friends slowly, but having a child has really helped to ease that process. Instantaneously, I feel that I have something in common with other moms of similar aged children. I have met moms at Mom's groups, through other friends, through my temple, and through my son's school. Because all of us are focused on similar issues around raising and enjoying same-age children, we have much in common.

Interestingly, while I became more distant from some of my old friends, I also became closer to others. I even became closer to some of my single, childless friends because they were people who really wanted young children in their lives.

I sympathize with how painful it is to have friendships shift, and hope that you will make new connenctions with new friends. Nanu

I found people's responses there comforting, so you might also. It's now two years later, and things have improved. Years(!) of attempts like those described in my post have yielded some results, so we do have more friendships with other famililes. We do sit and watch our children play together. It has also helped that my children are older, and can really talk with me. They are just better at filling my need for companionship. Part of our problem was we had some friends out of the area, so we have made it known that we LOVE houseguests. (Otherwise people assume you don't want them to stay with you.) This also has provided some really satisfying time with friends.

That said, it's never really the same. I just don't have the time (with work, housework, dealing with the children) that I used to have to spend with friends, especially on the day to day level, and this diminishes the intensity and immediacy of friendships, though I think I put a considerable amount of effort into friendships. But some of my friends who have kids are plainly too busy to be friends with me now. Also, my friends and I used to discuss everything in our lives, and now I (and I think from observation, they too) feel inhibited in discussing our relationships to our spouses, and to a lesser extent our children and our finances. Though this saddens me, I guess I have just learned that it's just the way things are. I hope that later in life, when I and others have more time, I will again find the kinds of friendships that I had when I was younger. In the mean time, I am more content with the gains I have made. Looked for friendly advice

Of course they're entitled to whatever reaction they have to me, my son, our family. But you know what? I've decided I don't need to counsel these friends, or be understanding of their indifference or discomfort--my initial reaction, as I'm the one who's made the ''change'' in our relationship. Instead, I've decided to just ''give up'' on some of those friendships for the time being. Rather than being repeatedly frustrated or hurt by my interactions with these people, it's been easier to tell myself that my childless friends will figure it all out one day, if they have kids, and that in the meantime we all have different priorities emotionally and more practically, as well. Or that even without kids of their own, they'll get it eventually. I get angry at some of them for ignoring my son, not asking after him, assuming he's a burden or an interference with ''real life''; but I can't ask those people to change. Having made this decision, I feel that a real burden has been lifted from my shoulders.

One more thing--have you been able to meet other people wiith children? Or have you perhaps found that you have a new relationship with any friends, colleagues, or family who also have kids? I know you said that you don't make friends quickly, but perhaps even small, slow connections with others with children will make you feel less isolated. I have been wonderfully surprised by the new friendships we've started to grow with others with young children, and with how having a child of my own has allowed me to understand better those around me with kids. I suspect that not so long ago I may have been one of those hurtful or perhaps just clueless, childless friends--and now I ''get it.''

Hang in there--I know this can sound trite, but things really will get better as you grow a new circle of acquaintances and friends. brigid