Berkeley Parents Network: Rats & Mice

The attic of our rented house is intermittently invaded by rats. Some months, there are no rats; other months, there are many, and their wild revels and squeaking battles wake us at night. Our landlady brought in an exterminator, who said that trying to trap or kill the rats might be an expensive exercise in futility. He gave two reasons: one is that the rats are absent right now, although they have left abundant evidence of their past occupancy. (He did lay traps, and caught nothing.) The other reason is that there are so very many holes and paths into the attic that new rats are free to enter at will. He thought it would be a vast undertaking to close off all the points of entry, which include the tops of many hollow walls, as well as many openings through the exterior walls. We are reluctant to impose large expenses on our landlady, both out of gratitude to her, and out of enlightened self- interest.

What we'd like to find is some sort of device or substance that would discourage rats from remaining in the attic. We don't want to poison them, because the attic is very difficult to access, and we might well be stuck with a ceiling full of decaying rat carcasses. We're hoping you can point us to noise makers, light sources, or odors that bother rats more than than they do people. Any ideas? (For various reasons, cats, pythons, ferrets, and terriers are out of the question.) Wishing I knew the Pied Piper

I 'm sorry to say but the safest most effective way to repel rats is to do all the things the exterminator recommended: plugging up all the holes and setting snap traps. Smells, lights, sounds and any other kind of sonic devices are useless against rats. You will also need to remove any food sources, junk piles around the house, if any, and thin or eliminate overgrown shrubs or ivy that might harbor rats, or large thick tree branches touching the roof of the house. It is a lot of work, but rats are not a good thing to have around the house. If you don't want to burden the landlady, I suggest you do the work yourself. Here are some websites that explain in detail just how to rat proof your home. They all discourage using poisons for the reason you mentioned, and they also discourage using live traps because most rats are introduced pests in the community that carry diseases.

http://www.ipm.ucdavis.edu/PMG/PESTNOTES/pn74106.html

http://www.ecologycenter.org/erc/fact_sheets/rodent_control.html

http://npspests.cas.psu.edu/articles/RATsheet.html

Good luck! Laurey

Mice Attack!

Nov 2003

Our second story flat has recently been invaded by mice. We had them once before, but we introduced some poison and they dissapeared. The folks downstairs just got a cat and coincidently the mice started coming back to our place for dinner. First they would just hang out in the pantry, nibbling on rice, oats and a variety of grains, but after we boarded up the hole in there, they began appearing in the living room, hallways, even the office. Not cool. Problem is, now we have a 7 month old and we're not so comfortable with poison as we once were. Any non-toxic, non- cat solutions? (I'm allergic) mickey

There are three things you need to do:

1) Go through your home with a fine tooth comb and plug up any holes that may lead to the interior spaces of your walls. They can come in anywhere. And remember, a mouse can squeeze through a hole no bigger than the diameter of it's head. Check where all plumming goes into your walls. Check all electrical outlets. Check all hidden places like nooks and crannies in closets and storage areas. We found a hole where mice were coming in in one of our built-in shelves. They can even enter where a small hole has been drilled for t.v.cable lines. Once you locate ALL your holes, plug them up with steel wool. Mice and rats will not attempt to chew through this stuff. Make sure it is a tight fit so that it doesn't fall out. If the whole is really big then you will have to use a wire mesh with a small weave or a sheet of metal, then cover that up some kind material typically used for patching walls.

2) Set mouse traps. They are non toxic. If you don't like killing them, then you can buy humane traps. Victor makes them and they can be bought at a hardware store. Just keep in mind when ever you use traps, always bait them without setting the trap for a while to get the mice use to getting food from them. Once they are comfortable with eating from the trap, then you set them. Make sure you place the traps in hidden areas so that they are less afraid to approach them. And don't forget to check them.

3) seal up all your food in airtight plastic or glass containers. Leaving grains and nuts lying around on your shelves in their original bags only asks for trouble with pests. Not only will mice and rats chew through the bags, but moths and grain beetles will find the food as well. Also find any other sources of possible food like stuffed animals or dolls that are filled with littles beans. Laurey

Please do NOT use poison to get rid of mice and rats. If the mice or rats ingest poison and are then caught and eaten by owls, hawks, cats, or dogs, those animals will die from eating the poisoned mouse/rat. A friend of mine works at the Lindsey Wildlife Museum in Walnut Creek. She said that someone brought in a barn owl during her last shift there. The owl had been poisoned and was in very obvious distress. The staff tried to save it, but the owl died.

If you have a mouse or rat infestion, the best solution (I know that it is not for the squeamish) is to (1) plug any holes that they are coming in through and (2) set a lot of snap traps (a lot = one dozen or more). Also, you should/can call the rodent control person in the city that you live in. These people are quite knowledgeable and can figure out where the mice/rats are coming into your house.

Also, clear away thick ivy in your yard, and do not store bird seed or dog/cat food in your garage (unless you use chew proof containers) because that will attract mice or rats to your garage and then your house. Janet

For the mice: the old fashioned mousetrap is a bit gross but can be effective. Bait it with a firm bread, stuck firmly in the trap, dipped in peanut butter. Throw mouse and trap out together--I find a trap does not work as well the second time. The wood ones are very cheap. Find all the holes you can and plug them with metal pot scraper ball thingees (chungas), especially around the pipes under your sink. Set traps where baby can't go! Trapper John

Re the rats, having dealt with them myself, the best solution is plain old-fashioned rat traps. Using poisons has a couple of important disadvantages. Of course, it introduces toxins (toxic to humans as well as rats) into your home, and it is not uncommon for the rats to die inside your walls. Then you have a stinking carcass to remove that can be hard to find. Cecelia

HELP! Rats in the cellar

Jan 2003

We've owned our home for 1.5 years, and recently some animals, probably rats, have been pulling down the insulation. My husband found a dead rat and a nestlike spot, which he removed, and we are now getting nasty smells wafting through the house. Any recommendations as to who to call and what to do? Has anyone solved this one on their own? Of course, we are horrified! No evidence of anything in the actual house YET. Our cellar is mostly a dirt floored crawl space, and we have a floor furnace. --disgusted in san leandro

Having just fought (and won, I think) a major rat battle, I advise you to call Alameda County Vector Control. They have been amazingly helpful to both me and my neighbor (who also has rats, although a different kind). Tabe, the resident rat expert, has visited our house twice and our neighbor's house several times more, diagnosed what kind of rats we had, showed us where the rats have been coming in, told us how to keep them out, came back to look at what we had done to fix the problem and gave us more advice, followed up with phone calls to see how things were going, and in general has made us both feel pretty darn warm and fuzzy about the way our tax dollars are being spent. I highly recommend taking advantage of this free service. Nelly

Critter living among us

Jan 2003

We have some sort of animal living in our heating vent. We can hear it at night in the living room vent which is right above the garage. It is the only vent we hear it in. We called Animal Control and after they told us it might be a roof rat, they pretty much said, ''good luck getting rid of it.'' We're at a loss as to who to call next. An exterminator? A heating specialist? Any and all advice is greatly appreciated. Our biggest concerns are 1) the animal's urine is smelling up our house (we thought originally the smell was from our cats) and 2) it will die in the vent and really stink up the place. Allison

Ace hardware carries a product that you plug into an outlet, it affects sound vibrations thru the electrical sytem, not audible to people, safe for pets but it keeps rodents away. Marc

i've heard about these things you plug into the wall that make a high pitched noise that drive rodents away--perhaps that would work for your ceiling animal? i don't know how well they work, and if you have gerbils it might be a problem, but it might be worth finding out more. joanne

A rat whose urine you can smell? That sounds like a giant. We recently had rats in our attic and had a great experience with Janet Elliott from Berkeley Health and Human Services. On the phone I described what I heard and answered some questions, and she decided it was rats. She then came to the house, looked all around outside for possible points of entry, poked around the attic and the kitchen (where I'd seen the furry things) and found where they were hanging out most, and advised us where to put traps and how to set them up. With her advice, we were rat- free within days, and it was all free. You can call her at 981-5310. Good luck.

We recently had the same problem...first it was a mouse wandering around our house...there was evidence of it everywhere, but in places not that obvious.We called a company called Ensure, for $150 they came out,detected the problem set traps and bait. They'll come up to three times and guarantee for 90 days. The mouse was caught within hours of laying the traps. Luckily it was only the one. However, I found a ''dying'' roof rat in our basement a month or so later, it had apparently gotten into the bait. It was shocking to find but at least it is gone. The co. also closes up any prospective openings that they can get into or at least points out those they can't get to. You could probably go to Long's or Target and buy the traps and set the bait yourself, but it was worth it to me to pay the $150 for them to come and deal with it....I can't believe a pest control co. said ''good luck getting rid of it...'' No More Critters...for now DL

Rat Control

Dec 2001

Ensure Pest Control (415-731-5288) solved our Montclair rat problem 3-1/2 years ago. Like you, we couldn't see our rats, but we could certainly hear them. We haven't seen or heard any rats since. -NORM

Most people don't like to hear this, but the only way I finally got rid of the mice in my house (big field running the length of the block behind the houses) was to put poison under the house where they were coming in. Had to do the same thing to get rid of the gophers (put poison in their holes). The good news is I've been mouse free for over a year and gopher free for over two years. I now have two cats (in the house) that find any moving piece of dust a toy so I am not anticipating any return any time soon of the mice. At least in the house. And I am also guilty of using those sticky traps as well. It was the only way to catch the babies that were already in the house. This was pre-cat so I won't have to go to that extreme again. I have a couple of neighbors who refused to be so inhumane and still have mice problems. They are continuing to try all the humane methods available and continuing to find things chewed up and droppings all over their formally nice clean counters. I really feel for them, but I consider invading mice (especially deermice and roofrats) to be disease spreading rodents and not nice sweet house pets that you keep in a cage, so my conscience is clear on this one. marianne

Exterinator for Mice

Oct 2002

We have a mice problem in the duplex I live in. I called one of the exterminators recommended some time ago and was quoted a price of $125.00 to come out and set out bait in traps and then come back five days later to check on it. They give a three month guarantee. I'm curious if anyone has used anyone's services recently and if this price sounds about right. I have no idea what one pays for this service. Not looking forward to this. I.S.

I full heartedly recommend ''Employ Exterminators.'' Richard has come to my home three times already regarding a mice problem and has also consulted with me about ants and spiders. He is very knowledgeable and honest. You can't do better. They can be reached at: 836-4500. Good luck.

Exterminator for Mouse-Phobic Mom

2000

Can anyone recommend an exterminator to get rid of mouse in our rented house? I am a single mom with a young toddler and a dog and I don't want anything done which could harm them in terms of whatever is used. I am also terribly phobic of mice so I won't be setting or picking up traps myself so I'd appreciate recommendations of local exterminators and info regarding what this should cost and how much time it takes to get rid of them. We live in El Cerrito...thanks so much!!!

Try to contact your Animals Control in the City of El Cerrito. They might be able to help you. They provide free service too. Good luck!!!

Heather
"Employ Exterminators" 836-4500 in Berkeley, Richard REALLY knows a lot about mice, roof rats, and ants! Family business -- we have used them for two years and are delighted - they respond promptly whenever a problem pops up (yellow jackets were attacking us. They were there that afternoon. Ant infestation - ASAP, usually the same day or next morning).

I highly recommend Brinkman Pest Control at 510-530-6133. They are great people to work with and more importantly effective at exterminating a mouse (laying down traps & removing them). I called all around when we had a small problem and they were also one of the most reasonably priced. Good luck.

Nina
We had a terrible problem with rodents in a house in the Sierras. Our cat was useful, but the thing that really did the trick was a device my brother bought at a local hardware store that emitted a high-pitched noise that is apparently painful to mice. My recollection is that it had different levels including some that were inaudible to humans and others that were not a problem for pets. We turned it on only when we were not in the house; it worked (continues to, actually) like a charm.

Sherry
You can call the pest control of your county's health department. I had a wonderful experience with the Alameda County Pest control, the officer came with a thorough inspection, and put several cages (traps) on each openings, he came back to pick up the cages and the mice to the lab for inspection. Then, he gave our landlord a list of repair works required to do within certain days. Your landlord is liable for all the pest related work if there are holds or openings need to be mended.

Humane Mouse Traps

April 2000

One of our much-loved pet mice has escaped and may be in our subarea along with some wild mice: I found a new mixture of pet and wild mouse poops just last night. Does anyone who lives around campus or North Berkeley, or works on campus, have a humane mouse trap they would be willing to loan me short term? (I admit to being one of those who set snap-traps when trying to eradicate mice.) Fran

The Ecology Center (San Pablo at Dwight; number in the phone book) used to rent humane mice traps for a nominal fee (only a couple of dollars for a week's use). They may still have them available for rent. Jennifer

Mouse Problem

Feb 2000

Hi, We have a mice problem. We've set all kinds of traps (humane) and catch mice, but apparently not enough. They seem to be spreading and I have recently found mouse poop on my children's clothing. Can anyone recommend anyone who can help me take of this problem.

I know you're looking for an expert, but while waiting for one, here are some considerations that we've used successfully for trapping mice in our own home (some we read about, some common sense, some which just worked):
1. Set lots of traps at a time. We've caught 3-4 mice in one 12 hour period some days with about 8 traps set at a time among 3 rooms. Reset sprung traps right away--our mouse problems seem to have come in waves.
2. Set the traps along walls. Mice are timid and prefer to keep away from open spaces.
3. Set traps around where the mice come in (if you have an idea of where), where the mice go for food, and places in between.
4. Release the mice *blocks* away from your house. I have to admit we use regular mouse traps--cheap so you can have a lot at one time, and fast to empty and reset. Fran

Please post anonymously! I don't want PETA after me! If you see one mouse, you probably have a lot of mice. They will poop throughout your clothes,silverware, etc. eventually and even breed there. I buy loads of inexpensive snap traps and set them everywhere, using bread crust and peanut butter as bait. I don't like killing them, but I believe it is the most humane way to eliminate them, as there is little chance that they will survive if caught and released. If they do survive, it will be at the expense of some mouse that already was in the habitat you release yours into. Also you can spread house mouse diseases to wild mice populations, etc. The mouse usually dies instantly when the trap snaps,instead of starving to death slowly outside somewhere. Anyway, I never use a snap trap twice but simply throw the mouse and the trap out. I make a full-on attack -- lots of traps for several days, and then I generally am rid of them for a long time. Less messy are glue traps but they gross me out. At the same time, you can stop or almost stop more of them from getting in the house, and spare yourself the further killing of them, by assiduously plugging every hole. Ventilation holes need to be covered with screen. Gaps in walls and foundations can be plugged with a hardening foam you buy at the hardware store. The gaps where pipes come in and other holes can be plugged with metal scrubbies. Mice can't chew through the metal, they are cheap, and you can stuff them in gaps and holes.

By the way, as a parent, I think kids should know that we take up space on this planet, and that it is at the cost of other species and habitat, no matter how much we try to pretend otherwise. One house is the death of many creatures, starting when the lot is cleared for building, the road is paved to our door, the lines are laid for sewer, electricity, and so on. We should use our time and space well in respect of that.

Roger
Mice and the parasites that they carry are a serious health threat to you and your children. This is no time to worry about being "Humane". (What's more "Humane" anyway - starving to death or having the neck snapped in a fraction of a second? They shoot horses don't they?) Just use spring traps - lots of them - baited with peanut butter. Bait and set the traps just before lights out. Then just try not to react to the sound of traps snapping. If you're squemish about emptying the traps in the morning, don't. Just throw the whole mess away and start the next night with fresh traps. Make sure you change the bait in the ones that don't go off. Mice tend to follow along the base of the walls, so put the traps right next to the walls so they won't miss them. If you don't know which way they'll be coming, put two back to back so they'll encounter the bait no matter which way they come from. Show your kids the traps and explain how they work and how dangerous to little fingers they are. Also show them where you intend to place them so they don't walk into them, and so they will know what the noise is if they happen to hear it. Pick up the traps in the morning so the kids can't play with them. Horror story- A mouse ran across my bearded chin in bed one night. - luckily we had a trap on hand and after baiting it with peanut butter and placing it along the wall in our bedroom, we only had to wait about three minutes before the mouse found it. Also, getting a cat can be extremely effective. We haven't had a mouse in the house since a cat adopted us ten years ago. I'm very allergic to cats, but he spends most of his time outdoors, is not allowed up stairs in the bedroom area, or on the furniture. Also, we use a whole house electrostatic air filter to keep allergens under control. I also wash my hands immeadiately after touching the cat.

Susan
Recommendation to rid of mice in humane manner: I heard peppermint essence works b/c they hate the smell of it. I've used it and the mice are no longer here... but who knows? I read from BIRC's literature that those high frequency noise makers don't work although the mice disappeared. Unfortunately, I didn't do a controlled experiment... I just applied every humane repellent known to rid of them asap! I think many of the essence stores like body time in Berkeley has peppermint essence.. I believe you have to place only several drops every week or so. Also try calling BIRC... look for it in white pages...it stands for Berkeley Integrated? something something. It's a non-profit org. that provides info to public on using alternatives to harmful chemicals such as pesticides and cleaning products. I have now been using only baking soda, oils and soaps from the kitchen to prevent fungi and aphid infestations on my roses, using very effective iron sulfate tablets for snails/slugs, and am in the process of replacing all household chemicals so all I have are vinegar, baking soda, borax and bon ami as the worst chemicals in my home. I believe they'll send you one free fact sheet for a particular topic... then the annual membership is $30 of $35/year and it supports a great project. They're unfortunately very unorganized so sometimes you have to be patient w/ them.

Christina
I have a suggestion for you and it's even FREE!! We had a big problem with mice and called the Alameda County Vector Control Office (in the government pages of the phone book). An inspector came out and identified points of entry into the house and recommended ways to seal them up. Believe it or not, it seems some mice were coming in right through the front door! We had a double door and at the bottom there was a small gap in the weatherstripping on each door and that's where they were coming in. The fix for that space was simply putting on new weatherstripping that fit better. Another area where mice were entering our house was at plumbing for the toilets. There was a tiny gap between the sheetrock and the pipes coming out of the wall. The inspector recommended a product you spray into the gap and it foams up and dries hard, thereby sealing the space. We took care of the recommended fix-its and didn't have a problem after that.

If you can, get a cat. It's the best and surest way to never have any mice around your vicinity. Second best, get your neighbors a cat.

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